Sonic Youth Gossip - The Mighty Football Thread

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Fuuuck!!!! Dunno what to say. Thems the breaks I s'ppose.

anyway, yeah, pure bollocks from Mourinho in the post match.

dortmund beats hannover 4-2 with great help from hannover's new brazilian defender fernando (?) (1 penalty, 1 own-goal).

bayern beats augsburg 2-1 with help from the ref who gifted them an unlikely elfmeter on minute 88.

strange weekend.

Good piece about Everton and Roberto Martinez

Quote:

Everton got nowhere near the credit they deserved for the 3-1 thumping of Chelsea at the weekend. Partly that is due to the fact that the defending champions making such a wretched start to the season will always be a bigger story, especially if it can be illustrated with pictures of a grumpy José Mourinho. But partly it is due to Everton’s own status as a nearly team, an up-and-down sort of side, a typical Roberto Martínez outfit.

In the wider scheme of things Everton are not expected to carry on like that all season, to terrorise all who come to Goodison Park and make a serious push for a Champions League place. It could happen, but most probably it won’t. Fortress Goodison got off to a limp start to the season when Watford came along and gave the home side a scare. A 2-2 draw was a reasonable result in the end but it still had supporters expressing doubts, once again, over Martínez’s style of management and suitability for the job. Those same supporters are happy again now, after a joyous afternoon against Chelsea when every single one of Martínez’s decisions came off – better not to ask what might have happened if Muhamed Besic had not picked up an early injury and Steven Naismith remained on the bench all afternoon – but every Everton fan is aware the Midas touch could disappear again just as quickly. Such as on Saturday afternoon, for instance, when Martínez returns to Swansea.

That is not to imply Everton will lose at a ground where they gained a respectable point last season, just to point out that their form and results can be wildly unpredictable. Everyone feared the worst when Everton had to go to Southampton after the disappointing display against Watford, a stylish 3-0 away win was a long way from what most people were expecting.

Similarly there was nothing in the next two games, a defeat by Manchester City and a scoreless draw at Spurs, to suggest that Chelsea could be overcome so emphatically when Premier League football resumed after the international break. Mourinho’s side had a lot to do with their own downfall – teams such as Swansea and West Bromwich are likely to allow Ross Barkley less time on the ball than Chelsea permitted him – but on the other hand Everton were not backward in coming forward.

They poured enthusiastically into the miles of space behind Chelsea’s high line, not always using it effectively if the truth be known, created enough chances to win the game by a distance and finished three of them crisply. Defensively they were just as good, with John Stones practically taunting Mourinho with his calmness and ability on the ball, Phil Jagielka putting in his usual shift and Brendan Galloway excelling at left-back as a replacement for the injured Leighton Baines. Martínez deserves praise for his handling of the whole Stones situation, his willingness to trust that his player would not be distracted was amply vindicated by the performance against Chelsea, and it should also be noted that when he sent on Ramiro Funes Mori to make his Everton debut when Seamus Coleman was injured late in the game the home side were still only one goal ahead and the points were not yet safe.

Martínez undoubtedly looks the real deal at times – he even found an amusing riposte to Mourinho’s foul-mouthed rant in the tunnel after the game, though how newspapers can deem the single use of just one swearword as a rant is beyond most people’s comprehension. It just shows how desperate the media has become to make Mourinho the entire story. If the Queen or the pope ever start effing and jeffing then fair enough, that might count as front page news, but a football manager uttering a single expletive in the aftermath of a defeat is hardly in the same league. By current standards of prudery practically every football manager (not to mention players and supporters) is guilty of a foul-mouthed rant every Saturday afternoon.

But back to Martínez. Is this the start of something big at Everton, or is he simply doing what he used to at Wigan, namely producing stellar performances one week then mistake-ridden calamities the next? Roller-coaster would be the cliche of choice for the Martínez years at Wigan, beating all the big names in the Premier League but leaking points to lesser opponents all the while, though helter skelter might be a more apt description of the final few weeks, FA Cup glory notwithstanding. Martínez and Wigan never got the credit they deserved for taking Manchester City apart at Wembley either. Once again most of the coverage focused on the opposing manager – it turned out to be Roberto Mancini’s last game and City were therefore excused a lacklustre display – when in reality Martínez should have been lauded for his tactical acumen and his ability to get the absolute utmost form a collection of mostly ordinary players.

Martínez has a much better selection of players at his disposal now. Perhaps not a Champions League standard squad – whatever that is, after the two Manchester sides’ results on Tuesday – but there is no way players such as Barkley, Stones and Romelu Lukaku can be described as ordinary. Ask the manager for his ambition for the season and he would say a top-four finish.

Get into the Champions League and beef up the squad with a few more better than average players. At the moment that seems a reasonable aim – Everton have made a better start to the season than Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs – though it is an assessment that really needs to be made in the second half of the season, not the first couple of months.

Everton need to develop consistency, to become a team feared by opponents for picking up points as well as rave reviews. Everyone knows they can hit the heights, everyone also knows there are likely to be troughs as well. Right now with Everton the tendency is to wait for the next result to put the last one into perspective. If Martínez can break that spell he could take his side to the next level. Confidence is currently coursing through the club, though the same could be said of Crystal Palace, Leicester, Swansea and West Ham.

Everton need to show they can top that mini-group first, before they aim any higher. It is traditional at this point to observe that Everton, or someone like them, will have a good chance in the cups if they are not quite strong enough for the league but can raise their game when the occasion demands. That is both patronising and old-fashioned. The cups have had their day. Consistency is now the bigger prize.

Martinez's ridiculous levels of optimism can grate. However, it does make a change from Moyes' negativity (some of the things he said still sting).

Swansea is a tipping point game I think. Win and the mood will continue to rise. Lose and a lot of people will write the rest of the season off with an average finishing place.

Completely agree about teams like Everton never getting the credit when they beat the bigger teams. The same thing's happened to West Ham beating Arsenal and Liverpool. It's happening right now with us leading Man C. Listening to the commentators it's all about what's wrong with them, instead of saying how good we've been.

Anyway, half time, 2-1 up. Even if we lose we've been brilliant. If Payet carries on in his current form we're gonna have a helluva job keeping him in the summer.

Back to the match, fingernails gone.

EDIT: We held on (and it really was holding on). 2-1 it is. Rode our luck big time in the end but we beat Man City, at the Etihad. Fucking hell!!!

Edit #2: Finally had enough of Costa. The guy's just a nasty piece of work, end of, and Mourinho's defence of him (while expected) is a disgrace. Mourinho's doing to Chelsea what he did to Real, making them hated, and I can seriously see Abramovich having enough of it, maybe not before the end of this season but I can seriously see Jose either walking or being sacked before the start of the next one.

The French commentators stressed that Costa should have been expelled. Slap a defender, knock him down, and you usually get sent away. The referee's decision was very poor, to say the least.

I found Mourinho's talk so childish that it failed to make me more irate.
He praised his team for being serene. This meant that Arsenal had not been. He surely can't think Costa was serene, can he?
Has the World Wrestling Entertainment considered approaching Mourinho?

West Ham and Everton have been really fluent.
I'm surprised Norwich is currently so high in the table. I'm yet to see one of their games though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bertrand

Has the World Wrestling Entertainment considered approaching Mourinho?

You never know

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bertrand

West Ham and Everton have been really fluent.

West Ham are very unpredictable. We're playing really well against teams we shouldn't have a chance against but seem to struggle against those we might more reasonably expect to beat, especially at home. We seem to function better as underdogs. Most importantly, though, win or lose, we're fun to watch again, which we never were with Allardyce, even when we won. So far I'm more than happy with what Bilic is doing.

ONE SENTENCE SUMMING UPS

-Well done to West Ham!

-What a prick Costa is, and the ref fucked up big time

-Bayern win again, big whoop

-I'm gonna bet my house that Newcastle go down.

lol bayern played darmstadt which was just promoted-- try instead dortmund vs leverkusen which starts in an hour. that should be a mighty contest.

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

lol bayern played darmstadt which was just promoted-- try instead dortmund vs leverkusen which starts in an hour. that should be a mighty contest.

:D

Hook, line and sinker.

Quote:

Originally Posted by h8kurdt

:D

Hook, line and sinker.

haaa haaa haaa! i must spread more butter....

the dortmund bayer game was sweet

it started pretty tight but dortmund managed to squeek a 1-0 by halftime. then 2-0 by 60'. then i could have been 2-1 but instead went 3-0 on a penalty. dortmund keeps the lead on the table! mhuahahahahahaha.

demonyo sez he misses the classic defender over the goal-scoring semi-midfileder modern defenders-- he should have seen sokratis vs. chicharito today . hilarious duel.

Arsenal were apparently looking at Sokratis last year, not that Arsenal actually buys players. They just look at them.

And how's Hernandez doing at Leverkusen? Something about him, I really want him to do well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by h8kurdt

Swansea is a tipping point game I think. Win and the mood will continue to rise. Lose and a lot of people will write the rest of the season off with an average finishing place.

So where did the draw leave things?

Quote:

Originally Posted by h8kurdt

-I'm gonna bet my house that Newcastle go down.

Newcastle, Sunderland and one other for me. Hopefully Villa.

chicharito scored in the champions mid-week (his first @ leverkusen) but not today.

sokratis would NOT let him get even close.

Shame the game's changed to the extent that defenders like that are now so overlooked. It happens here all the time. Not knocking John Stones, who I think is excellent, but it's telling how he's been elevated so much higher than guys like Ryan Shawcross, who may not be as good with the ball but is a better out and out defender IMO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by h8kurdt

-Bayern win again, big whoop

Lewandowski scored 5 in 9 minutes tonight. Quick whoop

Quote:

Originally Posted by demonrail666

You never know

West Ham are very unpredictable. We're playing really well against teams we shouldn't have a chance against but seem to struggle against those we might more reasonably expect to beat, especially at home. We seem to function better as underdogs. Most importantly, though, win or lose, we're fun to watch again, which we never were with Allardyce, even when we won. So far I'm more than happy with what Bilic is doing.

I'd never have guessed re. the wrestling game...

Last season, WH were already more interesting than before (from a neutral point of view which almost lost its neutrality the moment Adrian, Cresswell, Kouyaté played...).

Quote:

Originally Posted by demonrail666

Lewandowski scored 5 in 9 minutes tonight. Quick whoop

That was insane and totally unexpected--a freak record.

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

That was insane and totally unexpected--a freak record.

Yeah never seen anything like that before, and against Wolfsburg. Hardly pushovers.

Bloody hell. I honestly thought it'd be a while before I'd see a glut of goals so quick after Lewandowski.

Chelsea's sinking again.
Mourinho's being a great help for his players: he introduced Matic at the break, and now, we're 20 minutes from the end... he replaces him...
Southampton leading 3-1 in London...

Mourinho's lost it. His rant in the post match interview was outrageous even by his standards. This on top of eva gate really makes me wonder if he isn't ultimately trying to get sacked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by demonrail666

Lewandowski scored 5 in 9 minutes tonight. Quick whoop

That is the kind of soccer an American audience could get into...

Speaking of cross culture exchange, you watching the Dolphins in London tomorrow?

No. Gf's birthday today. No chance.

Anyway. Rodgers finally sacked. Hearing strong rumours he's gonna be replaced by Ancelotti.

Probably bad news for h8kurdt. Can only see liverpool improving now bullshit-meister Brendan's gone, especially if they do get Ancelotti.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

That is the kind of soccer an American audience could get into...

Speaking of cross culture exchange, you watching the Dolphins in London tomorrow?

Sneaked a watch of the highlights last night. Not sure if the Jets are really good but the Dolphins looked bloody awful! But the tickets apparently sold out in record time so it's all good for the NFL and UK fans.

Dolphins are surprisingly bad this year

yesterday (morning, my time), bayern beat dortmund 5-1 on a regular bundesliga game

i was out all weekend on some business bullshit

I'M GLAD I DIDN'T SEE IT

Klopp now favourite for Das Kop

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/34448282

good luck with that highly charismatic but stubbornly inflexible guy.

Rest assured the press will love him (if it is him) and I'm sure the fans will give him time, but that team needs serious rebuilding. Lots of decent players but Coutinho's the only one who really stands out.

What was the set up at Dortmund? Was Klopp hands on in choosing new signings, cos if he was he might find life at Liverpool a bit of a shock. Seems pretty clear now that Rodgers didn't have much say in which players were signed or sold. That's why i think Ancelotti's a better fit. Besides IMO simply being a better manager than Klopp, he's shown that he's very comfortable with that kind of set up.

Personally, I think if it is Klopp, it'll only be because Ancelotti has turned them down.

i believe he was the one who built the winning dortmund

(but it was bayern that tore it apart)

(with the help of man u and others)

my problem with klopp is that when it didn't work he had no response

it's everything or nothing with him

It seems that at Liverpool the board have more influence over signings, but Klopp won't be going into that set up blind so he'll at least know what to expect.

Re his tactics, maybe he's one of those managers, a bit like Mourinho, or even Bielsa, who goes in, injects some real intensity, then, when that burns out, moves on to do it somewhere else. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he ends up making a big impact at Liverpool but doesn't stay that long.

EDIT: Just heard something on the radio saying that part of Klopp's contractual demands will probably says he wants a greater say in transfer dealings.

Brazil just went down 0-2 vs Chile. Pentachampions of the world my ass.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi

Brazil just went down 0-2 vs Chile. Pentachampions of the world my ass.

lolololol. those were ancient times. this is now.

this past summer chile won the copa américa and brazil didn't even make the semifinals.

hello 2015!

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

lolololol. those were ancient times. this is now.

this past summer chile won the copa américa and brazil didn't even make the semifinals.

hello 2015!

Yes yes, I watched almost every Copa América game. The Lone Star is being universally praised, and deservedly so.

USA better handle biz tomorrow, don't want to get humiliated again like the last time they played against Mexico at the Rose Bowl

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi

Yes yes, I watched almost every Copa América game. The Lone Star is being universally praised, and deservedly so.

They're the best fingerbangers for sure

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

They're the best fingerbangers for sure

You know, that was one moronic thing for Jara to do, but the conflict with Cavani already had a history. On the last Chile vs Uruguay game of the qualifiers for Brazil 2014 (Santiago, Chile 2-0), Cavani punched Jara in the face — I mean he clocked him, full fist on the guy's mug, and the defender simply stood there and nobody said jack. So, the finger shit, that was crass as hell, but payback was a-coming...

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi

You know, that was one moronic thing for Jara to do,

not moronic in the least but a stroke of genius-- especially the bullshit face-grabbing and fake rolling on the floor he did afterwards. he got cavani thrown out of the game! in spite of the later sanctions, he couldn't have done better for his team.

although that was probably bribe money... fucile was thrown out on a non-existent foul as well. truly scandalous. yes, yes, we still love this sport...

anyway...

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi

but the conflict with Cavani already had a history. On the last Chile vs Uruguay game of the qualifiers for Brazil 2014 (Santiago, Chile 2-0), Cavani punched Jara in the face — I mean he clocked him, full fist on the guy's mug, and the defender simply stood there and nobody said jack. So, the finger shit, that was crass as hell, but payback was a-coming...

strikers and defenders usually develop a history of some kind; i didn't know of this feud in particular but i'm not surprised. uruguay sucked in those qualifiers, and barely made it via a playoff with an oceania team (new zealand i think it was). so their fate did not change there.

but anyway, in a different setting--- google cavani-chiellini for some hilarious photography. why wait, i'll post it here, ha ha ha ha

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

uruguay sucked in those qualifiers, and barely made it via a playoff with an oceania team (new zealand i think it was).

It was actually Jordan, 5-0 global. Those poor bastards in Asia and Oceania, man...

So the K(l)op(p) finally got what t(he)y wanted

And big Sam to Sunderland

The poor fuckers