Sonic Youth Gossip - why do brits put r's where there are none??

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Quote:

Originally Posted by demonrail666

Yeah, I love that stuff too. I'm sure I mentioned this in another thread about being asked to say "mary", marry" and "merry" when i was in America because when I said it they all sounded completely different but when the people who asked me said it they sounded exactly the same. This was in Ohio, so I'm not sure if that's something specific to that region or not.

hahaha. when I say them out loud they pretty much sound the same to me. How the hell do you make them all sound different???

it's in the water, or rather, "woowta"

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeadDiscoDildo

Kentuckians do it too!

Warsh your clothes boy.

Why do people from new england remove "r"s?

paawk ya caaaah, retaaaahd

warsh is a south st. louis thing.

why do people from manchester say EHHHM? i don't know. i hear it 900 times a day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Satan

warsh is a south st. louis thing.

why do people from manchester say EHHHM? i don't know. i hear it 900 times a day.

that reads like a Scouser thing

Yeah, I always think of Liverpudlians when I hear the "eehm" thing, but then I watched this ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Wo2-PImEbc

My favourite scouse accent ever has to be Jamie Carragher's:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSD9XF6S5BE

Amazing.

Well it's actually just a link between two vowels to avoid hiatus, it's normally pronounced as a W rather than an R (I think I hear a W rather than an R in said interview - if my French ears aren't wrong though).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torn Curtain

it's normally pronounced as a W rather than an R

Only if you're Jonathan Ross.

Ok, it actually depends on the vowels :

Quote:

Liaison

Liaison is another process which involves the addition of a sound. In this case, a speaker
inserts a sound in order to ease the link between vowels at the end of one word and at the
beginning of an immediately following word.
The most well known case involves a historical < r > at the end of a word. In most British
accents, the < r > in a word like here is not pronounced if there is either a consonant
following in the next word, or silence. But if the immediately following word begins with a
vowel, the < r > does get pronounced: here in Britain / "hI@r Im "brItn= /. Such an / r / is
traditionally known as a ‘linking / r /’, as speakers use it to link up the end of one word with
the beginning of the next. Here are some more examples:

far "fA: far away "fA:r @"weI
near ____________ near enough ____________
there ____________ there on the floor ____________
floor ____________ next floor up ____________
stir ____________ stir in ____________
ever ____________ ever after ____________
more ____________ more examples ______________

Notice the kind of vowel that occurs in the first column: / A:, I@, E@, O@, 3:, @ /, all relatively
open or mid, and back or central/centring. It is now very common for native English
speakers to add / r / to any word ending in these vowels when the immediately following
word begins with a vowel – even if there is no ‘historical’ / r / in the spelling. There was, in
the 1960s and 70s, a fierce controversy as to whether this ‘non-historical’ / r / liaison was
acceptable in contemporary Received Pronunciation, but it is now widely heard and accepted
as a current form, based on the analogy of the ‘linking / r /. But because of that controversy,
this ‘non-historical’ case is usually referred to as the ‘intrusive / r /’. Here are some
examples:

spa "spA: the spa is open D@ "spA:r Iz "@Up@n
media __________ media operation ____________________
law __________ law in Scotland ____________________
milieu __________ milieu in society ____________________
Laura __________ Laura Ashley ____________________

Although the ‘intrusive / r /’ is added on the analogy of the ‘linking / r /’, it is basically an
identical process of liaison, easing the link between two vowels across a word boundary.
*
If a word ends in the vowels / i:, i, eI, aI, OI /, some speakers use / j / to link them to a vowel
at the beginning of an immediately following vowel. And if a word ends in the vowels
/ u:, u, aU, @U /, a / w / is often used to produce a similar link. Here are some examples:

see si: see off "si:j "Qf
stay __________ stay out ______________
high __________ high over ______________
toy __________ toy animals ______________
17
the end ______________
new __________ new information ____________
no __________ no idea ______________
how __________ how about ______________
to end ______________

Liaison with / r, j, w / - the three approximants – eases the link between any final vowel and
any vowel at the beginning of an immediately following word. It is thus another type of
simplification process.
*

http://cardiff.ac.uk/encap/resources...ishphrases.pdf

PS : the board can't display some phonetic symbols correctly :(

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torn Curtain

Ok, it actually depends on the vowels :

... The most well known case involves a historical < r > at the end of a word. In most British
accents, the < r > in a word like here is not pronounced if there is either a consonant
following in the next word, or silence. But if the immediately following word begins with a
vowel, the < r > does get pronounced: here in Britain / "hI@r Im "brItn= /. Such an / r / is
traditionally known as a ‘linking / r /’, as speakers use it to link up the end of one word with
the beginning of the next.

Exactly. "Here we go" poses no problems but "here it is" becomes "here-r-it is". The turning of 'in' into "im" in 'here in Britain' is also true. I just tried it. It's less obvious than the 'r' but definitely there. I'm not sure how widespread it is across other British accents but it's absolutely there in a London accent.

Implying that Londoners are real people.

Woss bis' 'ee taykin' piss out 'v I fowr miynd? Arr Terr's a proper geez mind, proper gert lush 'ee is.

I should note that Terry's from Divvywood, so you should take what he's saying with a pinch of salt.

Just be thankful that Bristol has no real equivalent to someone like Danny Dyer. At least Terry's an official comedian.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-5WDfs8nnE

i realize hevusa was probably trying to piss people off gratuitously when he started this thread, but now speaking of dialects & such--

i was watching this irish movie "intermission" this weekend and in the closing credits colin farrell sings "i fought the law"

ignore the twatty photos & notice at about 20-25 seconds:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWNdf9gsJZ4

i fought the lawr and the
law won

on a side note, he does a pretty good job with this cover

seems like the r serves to join with the upcoming a, so it's

i fought the lawrand the

the law won

anyway. coincidence, or magical realism?

Colin Farrell's overly exaggerated 'Oirish' accent aside, law, pronounced 'loor' ends more with a vowel sound, in that the 'r' really just accents the 'oo', giving the transitional 'r' that comes between 'law' and 'and' the same role as it would have between 'here' and 'it'.

Don't American's do the same thing with 'law', only making it more like "laar". Would they not have the same "laar-r-and the, laar won" thing? Or is it just another case of American exceptionalism?

Quote:

Originally Posted by demonrail666

Colin Farrell's overly exaggerated 'Oirish' accent aside, law, prononounced 'loor' ends more with a vowel sound in that the the 'r' reasly just accents the 'oo', givinn the transitional 'r' that comes between 'law' and 'and' the same role as it would have between 'here' and 'it'.

Don't American's do the same thing with 'law', only making it more like "laar". Would they not have the same "laar-r-and the, laar won" thing? Or is it just another case of American exceptionalism?

i've never heard anybody say they watch "laa-r-and order"

"law" stays clear of getting mixed up with order (it's American segregationism)

though i've heard plenty hicks saying they have "ideaRs"

or "i'm gunna waRsh the truck"

ps- here's the original version of the song by the crickets

clearly separated (but equal!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxmlcTVFvic

it was the 50s-- not a good time for civil rights

hahaha. I was actually thinking of Laa and aarder when I wrote that and sat in front of my computer doing a really bad American accent, trying to see if the transitional r worked. And you're right, it didn't. Which makes me wonder if it isn't more a geographically bound thing, rather than one related to the English language in general.

Anyway, I've decided that the New Jersey accent is now my favourite American accent of them all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vkTN4-GZQQ

Meanwhile, I'd happily pay this woman mucho pounds to shout at me like that

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpTkafjPKS8

The fact she's brandishing a power drill makes it even hotter, for some reason.