I'm not trying to buy elite. I've listened to the samples on iTunes, I've heard four of the songs played live. And noise isn't something necessary for me to enjoy Sonic Youth (I really like Murray Street). There's just so many things I'd rather spend my money on.

that's right, i took a little while to bought this album also, i've listened samples, songs on the radio ( incinerate was to much promoted ) , or other sources, and didn't make me run to the recordshop. i just bought it almost two years later after his released...anyway i think is a great album and - helen lundberg & turquoise boy - are still my favourite.

It's awful. A few good riffs, and not much more.

I agree generally, though I think "Or" is brilliant and quite evolved. Still, that's just 3 minutes tucked inconspicuously at the end.

I've been fanatical about the band for a quarter century, and I did find this particular record to be a mild let down, particularly coming on the heels of Nurse which was highly evolved. But they've had other bumps in the road and rebounded. Personally, I find EJT&NS to be devolved too (intentionally so even, with songs edited down into Guided By Voices wanna-be sketches when they could have soared), but so what, they followed it with Washing Machine, one of their best albums ever.

I think the "devolve" thing is sort of accurate. However, I don't think it was at all unintentional. It was a natural progression, in one sense, but somehow ended up somewhere behind where they started. They've always run a circuit through anti-pop and borderline-pop, and were bound to cross through the territory covered in RR. I'm not sure if that makes sense, but I'm glad they went the course their progression/regression/whatever did instead of trying to one-up themselves or go straight ahead. It just seems right. They've been circling that way since Murray Street.

RR is not necessarily an attempt at anything, but an inevitable "space" they were approaching, and filled it as always. Just like EJTNS (which I loved, but that's a whole other thing). They're bound to hit some spots that grate against fans, and most of the people I've met recently who "like Sonic Youth" only like Turquoise Boy and Incinerate, so they're doing something right, just not what we wanted.

I also think that Trees Outside was the departure from RR that I expected from SY next. I wonder if that will give the next SY album even more distance.

Rather Ripped is a "meh" album. Interesting at points, but ultimately falls flat.

You have a right to your opinion, and I never said that one must adore everything SY-related. But one thing is expressing your opinion and other is slaying a good record like RR, it might not be the typical SY record, but it has good songs in it.
To me this situation feels like what went down with Metallica during the Load and Re-Load period, they were heavily crictized for making alternative albums and completely disregard their metal roots, when actually they were taking a step forward and making some decent songs, even though those were not the typical songs one would expect to hear on a Metallica record.
After a few years they give in to the pressure and start to rush back to their roots, what's the result? Fucking shite albums with god awful sound, resulting on tours where they play almost only songs from the Black Album and earlier albums.

It's not like you can compare Metallica and SY (of course SY is THE shit :)), but this situation reminds me a lot of what Metallica went through, and I'd rather see the band I love go on a different direction, do something I don't expect them to do, but do it well, rather than giving in to pressures and ending up releasing big piles of real crap.
But that's my two cents.

im gonna do a song by song thing here....

1. "Reena" - 3/5
2. "Incinerate" - 5/5
3. "Do You Believe in Rapture?" - 0/5
4. "Sleepin' Around" - 0/5
5. "What a Waste" - 2.5/5
6. "Jams Run Free" - 3/5
7. "Rats" - 2.5/5
8. "Turquoise Boy" - 3.5/5
9. "Lights Out" - 1.5/5
10. "The Neutral" - 3/5
11. "Pink Steam" - 5/5
12. "Or" - 2/5

1. "Helen Lundeberg" - 0/5
2. "Eyeliner" - 0/5

few good tunes, not their best, not their worst.

"sleepin' around" is the worst sonic youth song of all time.

Not even close.

Rather Ripped is incredible.

I agree FULLY

I give up.

I'd take Rather Ripped over Experimental Jetset. That's not saying much though...

I don't think it has anything to do with Rather Ripped or that any comparison between the situations can be made at all, but those Metallica albums were NOT a step forward. They were steaming piles of shit that demonstrated an aging band out of ideas trying to cash in on the latest commercial trend. What Metallica "went through" was spending a fortune having an on site therapist to hold their hands while they cried like babies for having gone back on everything they stood for as a band outside the mainstream and become a pathetic cartoon who's only interest is in chasing after record sales through marketing schemes (and this goes back to the black album in my opinion).

The situation with Sonic Youth is in no way similar because their core fans have hardly abandonned them or done anything more than noted that the most recent record isn't great like the one before it. That's happened once or twice in the past through their almost thirty years as a band. It isn't really a big deal and doesn't mean the next record won't be incredible.

hey wait, i had missed this one!!!
and why is that then?

And "What a waste" is the worst Kim song of all time.

What a waste is a pretty good song. My least favourite is Kim Gordon & the Arthur Doyle Hand Cream

^^I tend to disagree.^^
Sorry.

Both songs are good....

I fuckin' love the song but hated they had to change it from Mariah Carey & TADHC.

The harmonic pings are very cool ! Who's doin' those? Jim O., Lee or Thurston ?