Q about depression...
 

Just curious. I know stress, etc. causes depression but...Um...are any of you depressed, like, ALL the time? I'm happy sometimes and I really am good at my job (teaching) but there's always this sense of overwhelming hopelessness. Even on meds, it takes alot of effort to just TRY to be normal.
And no, I'm not whining or feeling sorry for myself. This is just the way I am.

Short answer: Yes.

Long answer: I want to kill myself, even moments when I have nothing to be unhappy about. But, really, usually, there are lots of moments I should genuinely be unhappy, and those don't seem to effect me as strongly as they should. So, it's just a constant bad vibe I feel off of everything, and it's rarely amplified. I don't cry or anything, usually, I just kinda feel bad. I don't mope. I don't show it. Except on sy gossip. I don't even get angry -- maybe that's my problem. I don't yell at people. I should. I keep it bottled up. I've been on meds for 3 weeks. They stopped working last week. I need to probably take more or get put on a higher mg. I dunno. I feel like garbage all the time. Always have. Even when hot chicks want my bone, even when my music or movies become successful, I always am just like... hm. I focus on the problems. I focus on the anxieties. I can't just be happy. No matter how much money I have... no more how much "success" (again, HA HA) I may attain, it doesn't matter to me, mainly because material objects don't really matter to me. So, what's left? What is there left to work towards? I hate spending money, and there's nothing I want to buy with it. So, why am I even working? Because I'd go insane if I wasn't? But work drives me insane, too! I hate meeting people, because everyone is so flawed, and I feel like I'm an amazing friend -- I think I alienate people because I'm too good to them. I think I set an impossibly high standard upon which a worthy friend could never return the favor. And then, would I even want them to? Back when I had a working burner, I'd burn my friend 50 cd-r's a week for months on end. When he got an external, I borrowed it and put 500 albums a day on it (did I mention I have OCD?) for a few weeks. I was constantly making things for people, burning things for people, and then I just kinda stopped. I'm not really passionate about friendship anymore. Hell, I'm not sure if I'm passionate about anything anymore. Even sex is boring. I take everything to its logical extreme and then I just kinda lose interest. I feel like I've heard/read/seen everything that's worth hearing, reading, or seeing. I dunno. Life is just fucking pointless.

I used to be depressed a lot, mostly because of a lot of really shitty things happening all at once and letting them get to me. But I changed my outlook on life and my philosophies and now there's no reason to be depressed. Maybe you should take a step back and reflect on what you want and how you look at life.

^^^ That's good advice, terrible, but personally, I've noticed something about a lot of depressed people. Can't speak for 'em all, but I know a lot of intelligent depressed people, and I think that's the problem. Being put on meds just means you know your brain is lying to you. It's not like taking ecstasy, where you could go, "I SHOULDN'T BE FEELING LIKE THIS!" and yet you feel like it anyway. Ecstasy will usually genuinely make you happy, because of the .. things .. it triggers. Antidepressant meds aren't quite that strong, and I honestly feel nothing from them after a while, wondering if I'm just taking shitty placebos. In other words... a lot of depressed people have figured life out. Have you ever noticed how many truly intelligent, well-admired, wonderful people have killed themselves? Look at people like Hunter S. Thompson, Kurt Cobain (who I'm not a fan of, personally, but he was talented), etc. Suicide is the ultimate fashion symbol of the "antihero", maybe, but take a step back and truly look at these people and disconnect from their fanbases and all the literature written about them and just LOOK: These are all smart, clever people. While it's arguable that they didn't have their heads screwed on quite right because of "drugs" or whatever, that just goes for the examples I listed. Look at the famous-people-suicide-list on wikipedia and it'll blow your mind. Most of them were seemingly smart people! I think there is no "cure" for depression. And I think intelligent people realize this. And intelligent people realize that life is ultimately pointless. I have my own philosophies in life, but I can't help the way I personally feel, regardless of anything. I have been reading the Tibetan Book of the Dead a lot, and there's a lot of wisdom in there. I have looked at things differently. But I still feel sad. I wish I could lie to myself. Erase my memories. I dunno. I don't think any one thing has triggered it. Suicide runs in my family, and I was abused when I was little, so subconsciously I'm sure that all has made me disconnected. Which is weird. I am not a cold or uncaring person, but I am definitely disconnected. Contradicting? Maybe. I'm not sure. I just don't feel like I fit in or belong with people. Yet I'm also extremely popular. What the fuck?!

depression comes with the territory when you are smart AND curious about the world. being smart and ignorant of the world, you can easily dupe yrself.

Homer (having gained 70 IQ points because of removal of an old crayon from his skull) - "Lisa, how do you do it? It seems that the smarter I get the more people hate me."
Lisa -" Oh you know, Tai Chi, Chai Tea, the usual."

The only way to counter it, I have found, is to understand and accept that we all get just one life, and that very little actually matters to one's everyday life. People tell me I am self-delusional, but I truly feel that the relatively small amount of joyful, enjopyable, happy exciting, interesting things in the world make up for the myriad of shitstorm that is there.

like Jennthebenn's book. It made my week. I have been sick for 4 days, my g/f is sick, my mom is undergoing surgery, my new office manager and HR person told me that I am basically an overpaid clerk and that my 9 year employment here hangs on a shoestring my house is in severe disarray and I am broke (among a million other things I will not mention, personal and in the world), but that book in the mail, knowing that my online friend and fantasy football nemesis wrote it, and created it, and was kind enough to sell one to me, and that now I get to hold her creation and read it and laugh and be jealous of all her sonic youth shows, etc., that one thing is so joyous to me that it blinds me from the bullshit.

is that delusional?

do I care?

I also feel that Life is "pointless" in the long run. And I also believe that the more introspective and observant that a person is, the more likely they are to be depressed/unhappy. Really, life is only as pointless as we let it be (regardless of religious beliefs, etc.)

Over the last year or so (with the help of meds) I've begun looking at life in a more care-free manner. It's like I'm in on a little secret... life is pointless so I'll just do as I please and make myself happy and fulfilled while all these sheep run-around trying to impress and do what they're told is right. Mind you, I'm a reserved and calm person so my idea of being care-free isn't exactly hedonistic... it's just nice to be able to remind myself (and I often have to remind myself) that it truly doesn't matter what kind of impression I make on others. I or they could be dead tomorrow... and what we said or did in the past just won't matter in the long run.

Be happy. Do the things that you enjoy and don't think about things so much. I know it's easier said than done... that's why you have to practice happiness before you can actually live it. Sit on the couch with a significant other, or family member or dear friend or pet, and be warm and watch a favorite movie. Do anything that makes you smile and gets your mind off bullshit. Life may be pointless in the end, but there's still room to enjoy it :)

Oh hell yeah ... I can identify with that totally. Especially the part about effort. I have to constantly work on being ... not necessarily "normal" because to me "normal" is a lie ... somewhat acceptable to the drones I'm surrounded by. The only thing I've found that works for me is to just really concentrate on anything and everything that gives me even the slightest bit of joy or amusement, no matter how simple. Whether it's that first cup of coffee or a decent song popping up on the crap station we listen to at work or even laughing at a random moron ... to just enjoy the little things because I doubt I'll ever be thrilled with the bigger picture. It's the only time I'm able to quit focusing on "fixing" myself.

Of course life is pointless! What else could it be? You think we're here for a reason? Hell no. Of course a lot of people get depressed thinking about this (I didn't, but came pretty close) and part of life I think is accepting this and still managing to live your life how you want. And I definitely do not agree with the introspective statement, unless you come to some really grim conclusions while being introspective, which takes me back to my first post: if you're truly depressed you need to take a step back and work on your personal philosophy on life and what you want out of it. READ ALAN WATTS.

remember, that many times depression is not a result of the mind, but a chemical imbalance in the BRAIN.

analyzing shit will not help in this case.

Well yeah, that being the exception.

I'm usually not depressed unless there's a real reason for me to be depressed. I'm a pretty optimistic person, but sometimes when you think about the world and people, it can seem like everything is fucked up and there's no point. I like to remind myself at times of real depression that if I was dead, I couldn't enjoy simple things like food, music, and the company of people I love.

or the memory of standing in the front row at Sonic Youth's Pretty Fucking Dirty Tour in Houston TX after Pavement and the Pain Teens opened up and being given the honor of staring at Kim G's panty-clad mound, for she was wearing just heels, a t-shirt and panties, and it was delicious, and it gave me a sonic boner that has lasted for 18 years.

Please explain to me the difference between the "mind" and chemical imbalance in the brain.

I was under the impression you didn't believe in the existence of the soul.

i used to be. sometimes i am. sometimes i'm depressed and insane.

mostly i just don't give a shit about anything.

oh and i forgot
i never feel like i want to kill myself but a lot of times (like right now) i get in this mood that i want everyone else to just drop the fuck dead. i am sometimes extremely misanthropic.

For the vast majority of my life I was majorly depressed. I was on tons of medications, which all served to be just about as sucessful as I was functional....Somehow I managed to get my life together. I think it's because I started allowing myself to be angry rather than self-deprecating. This sounds kinda crazy but discovering Sonic Youth when I was a junior in high school became kind of a turning point in my life. I had never felt so connected to a piece of music. Listening to EJSTNS was kinda a moment that shook me up and really took me some place. It made me want to live kinda. Even if just for a moment. I started getting stoned and riding my bike to that album. It was the singular experience that I actually looked forward too.


But yeah, anyway, now I'm actually doing pretty well. In fact, I kinda like (love) life. I smile a lot. I think I'm happy. It's kinda scary.

A couple years ago, I was in depression but it wasn't any kind of depression I could not explain. It worked on so many levels (metaphilosophically, philosophically, practically, emotionally, etc.) that it was paralyzing. I spent whole days sleeping. I'm not sure how I got out of it but I did.

mind is consciousness, it springs forth from the hardware of the brain, the neural connections and all yr experience from conception on.
it also dies when you die.

no soul involved,.

some people are depressed because of their worldview, or their unreal expectations of life, or because of bad choices, or other such things. that is the mind. some people are depressed because their brain does not produce the right chemicals or produces too many other chemicals, and therefore creates an imabalnce, that the mind then experiences as depression.

two different things
one is treatable by therapy
the other by medication

So you separate experience from the body in that depression may be impressed on the mind by experience or it can express depression from chemical imbalance. Where does the chemical imbalance come from?

Defining the concept of "soul" entirely by its immorality is wrong. Your definition of the mind fits with what I know of Aristotle's definition of the soul.

if by "soul" you mean the individual consciousness of a living creature, then that's fine. but to most humans and religions a soul is an indestructible, everlasting, non-corporeal presence, existing whether or not a body/brain is alive. I don't believe in that "soul"

and in reference to depression, that was just a general description. of course there is a myriasd of grey area in between andmost people's depression are a result of both chemical and environmental influence.

however, what I said about medication and therapy is true. a chemical imbalance in the brain will not be repaired by therapy alone, and personal problems that cause depression are not helped by medication alone.