[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

I didn't feel like looking for old threads because frankly the search feature totally sucks..

discuss.

[noisereductions]

Downward Spiral is one of the most perfect albums beginning to end. Shrug.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Back in the day when it was all fresh and new I really couldn't appreciate it because I didn't like electronic aspects in music. The closest I could tolerate was some KMFDM and even that got too electronic for me.. i only listened to abrasive and obnoxious guitar music

I liked elements of NIN, I liked some songs. I liked things Trent Reznor was working on with other bands.

Its only more recently have I become interested in their back catalogue and digging up what is now old or classic material. and I am finding myself so much more enjoying it than I was able to twenty years ago. I still think it could use more guitar work, but that is generally my bias. However I can better appreciate the electronic elements from where I am at with music now. Indeed I am particularly digging things especially Broken and Pretty Hate Machine though I am still convinced that Antichrist Svperstar is Trent Reznor's down low best record

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

I am actually really enjoying With Teeth at the moment

[noisereductions]

With Teeth is excellent. It is def my favorite post-Fragile NIN album.

[dead_battery]

nin were amazing and made futuristic modern rock/electronic music, something that almost everyone seems to have abandoned as a worthwhile ideal by about 2000.

also nin and manson were expounding a worldview that seems to have been almost totally lost in pop culture now - a kind of pessimistic and dark revelling in humanities sickness but also exhilaratingly admitting to being in love with the pleasure and addictions that keep the sick show going. it wasn't about being guilty and self denying or optimistic. did the wars and recessions of the 00's wipe out expressions of this psychological in american culture?

[noisereductions]

SF, check out the live album And All That Could Have Been. Great setlist.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

currently on The Fragile.. wow. im impressed, this like Broken is the kindcof guitar work i wanted more of from NIN

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by dead_battery

nin were amazing and made futuristic modern rock/electronic music, something that almost everyone seems to have abandoned as a worthwhile ideal by about 2000.

also nin and manson were expounding a worldview that seems to have been almost totally lost in pop culture now - a kind of pessimistic and dark revelling in humanities sickness but also exhilaratingly admitting to being in love with the pleasure and addictions that keep the sick show going. it wasn't about being guilty and self denying or optimistic. did the wars and recessions of the 00's wipe out expressions of this psychological in american culture?

i was reading an article recently that talking about how 9/11 scared musicians away from the darker sides of music that were peaking in mid-to-late 1990s..

music was definitely darker then, more nihilistic, more abrasive.

[noisereductions]

^I agree, and I felt like it was something you could feel at the time. I big shift in tone. You can feel pre-9/11 and post. I mean, pre- shit like Limp Bizkit and any kind of immature frat punk was super popular. Post- it seems like that shit just was ignored. People got more into folksy type shit. Everything felt more serious.

[pepper_green]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

i was reading an article recently that talking about how 9/11 scared musicians away from the darker sides of music that were peaking in mid-to-late 1990s..

music was definitely darker then, more nihilistic, more abrasive.

I would love to read that article. got a link?

[pepper_green]

Originally Posted by noisereductions

^I agree, and I felt like it was something you could feel at the time. I big shift in tone. You can feel pre-9/11 and post. I mean, pre- shit like Limp Bizkit and any kind of immature frat punk was super popular. Post- it seems like that shit just was ignored. People got more into folksy type shit. Everything felt more serious.

what happen was the Strokes and The White Stripes just like Nirvana killed the hair metal. now you have goofy synthesized versions of those bands that don't register.

[noisereductions]

Originally Posted by pepper_green

what happen was the Strokes and The White Stripes just like Nirvana killed the hair metal. now you have goofy synthesized versions of those bands that don't register.

this is a fair point too.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by pepper_green

I would love to read that article. got a link?

i honestly don't even remember where i was reading it.. something about changes in pop music.. possibly theringer.com ?

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by noisereductions

this is a fair point too.

this always happens with all music. i suppose the 90s merging of grunge and industrial which influenced most of bands including radio bands had peaked and reached its course in popular appeal. after all it started out as an underground sound, it exploded because it resonated with so many people.

1994-1999 was the peak of industrial influenced hardcore and electronica and it was only natural that something new replaced it.

[dead_battery]

can i just say fuck the fucking strokes and the white stripes. they and every band like them were utter fucking garbage.

[pepper_green]

sure. you can say it. just saying that's what happened.

[dead_battery]

how it happened i dont know, i guess evil always wins

[Severian]

If you think NIN needed more guitars, you haven't heard Broken.

"They" were just such an exhilarating presence back in the day. They were all over the place musically, with albums like Pretty Hate Machine, which was in the company of Depeche Mode and New Order, Broken, which was more metal than anything Pantera ever did, and of course The Downward Spiral, which really opened the door for mainstream appreciation of electronic music.

Also, Trent had some downright CLASSIC singles back in the '90s. "Closer" was in many ways the definitive Alternative single, as it contained really "edgy" and messed up lyrics, but had a disco beat and a real minimalist production... Remove the cursing and the video and it could have been a #1 Madonna song.

Also, the non-radio version had extended movements and stanzas... It was sprawling, but tight as fuck, even at the 7 minute mark.

And "The Perfect Drug" was just a killer acid/techno track -- befitting an Aphex Twin remix track and remix maxi single, but again it had pure pop in its veins, and it was catchy and funky as hell.

Really great shit. I started to dislike their singles when "We're in this together" came out (that was a bloated ass song), but most of the rest of The Fragile is great.

At first I didn't even try to listen to With Teeth and Year Zero, because I was in a real elitist phase, and those singles didn't have the "magic" of what I dug growing up. But eventually I came around. All those latter day NIN records are really quite strong, and The Slip was a surprisingly great album (and a surprise album in generall if I remember correctly).

I'm a lifer NIN fan. Like Nirvana, that stuff just grabbed me by the balls when k was an angsty little dude. I always admired Trent's range. Like touring with Bowie. It was like the "mainstream" version of Sonic Youth opening for Neil Young and Crazy Horse, only it was more palatable to fans of both artists. I caught them live together actually.

I was unimpressed by Hesitation Marks, but it's not like that's going to change my feelings about NIN in general. Really one of the best "big" acts of the '90s. Also got me into Aphex Twin and Autechre (and Plaid). Honestly I can pretty much thank Trent for sparking my enduring interest in and love of electronic music of all varieties.

Glad to hear some positive NIN talk.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by dead_battery

can i just say fuck the fucking strokes and the white stripes. they and every band like them were utter fucking garbage.

I still think White Stripes were a great band. Honestly. I don't care how uncool that makes me seem. It took me forever to actually appreciate them, and I was a hold out until well after Elephant came out. But I saw them live for the second time somewhere around '04 and they blew the roof off the place.

Then I revisited their records and I was surprised by how many of the bands I loved are reflected in their music. Stooges? Nirvana? Pixies? Rolling Stones? Beatles? Modern Lovers? The Fall? All of the above. They made great jangly, occasionally even ass-kicking, rock music.

Strokes had a promising ear for melody, but they fizzled early and they've been an embarrassment to music ever since. The White Stripes were one of the great bands of their time. Just my opinion. Not a favorite band or anything, but definitely a solid one.