[space]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

all the gay boys wanna tap this

wow! does that make you a bitch or a whore for saying that?

[Rob Instigator]

it makes me a tease

[Rob Instigator]

Originally Posted by Genteel Death

Plenty of fish in the water and all that...
Of course some gay dudes and lesbians objectify as much as anyone. It's not less tedious when they make it the main topic of almost all conversations.

That makes sense

[amerikangod]

Also, way to shift this thread towards serious and worthwhile discourse while I was sleeping, you assholes. Except for the last page. I guess the cosmos sensed my return was imminent and worked through you all to make me feel more at home posting here again. Otherwise I might have entered, frozen momentarily and then run off like a startled deer. And you'd have lost my graceful beauty forever.

That said I guess all of this has pulled a completely serious comment out of me:

As far as I'm concerned, I never cared too much about how others perceived my comments on this board. Whether they've been viewed as dimwitted, as signs of a genuinely reprehensible man, as pure parody, as largely parody but with slivers of truth, as tired, as offensive, as infuriatingly single-minded, or just plain mediocre. I post here because it entertains me. When it stops entertaining me, I'll stop posting here. On that same note, my comments tend to be extremely sexualized because this is something that genuinely entertains and interests me. I am a horny dude. Correction: a very horny dude. I am loaded with hormones that make me think about fucking and being violent incessantly. I literally can't look at another human being without considering these things: a woman, fucking her (i.e. do I want to? If so, how?), a man, beating him to death (i.e. how would I do so if I needed to?) In my youth, I fought this basic biology. I wanted to cut myself off from it. Now, in my... well, I guess it's still my youth comparatively... I'm 27.... so in my latter days of youth, I've learned to embrace my biological leanings. In fact, I am enthralled with them. I'd say that I have a reasonably inteeligent mind (typo left in for 'irony'), and this mind has had to develop with these raging hormones. It's had to develop in spite of them, and alongside them. They've colored me every step of the way. I'm happy with where my mind is, developmentally, and I'm self aware.

As for our hyper-sexualized culture, I love it. I love it because it feeds my urges, tantalizes them, exploits them.... but mainly because it's a testament to nature itself. Our primal urges are so fucking strong that we simply can't escape them. They're an obsession that we are simultaneously aware and unaware of. No matter how much we want to play dress-up, we're still just animals. And I am very much at peace with this.

[Another serious comment to follow.]

[knox]

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator

the question that would help shine light on this thread is

"Do gay men ever feel shame at the way they objectify other men?"

Do lesbian women objectify other women? Is it purely a male thing?

I think that's where your confusion is Rob.

finding sexually attractive does not equal objectifying.

objectification has a dehumanizing aspect to it.

sexual attraction may or may not have an objectifying aspect to it.

In fact, there is even the possibility of sexual attraction that goes completely against objectification.

[Rob Instigator]

for sure, but it seems to me that it is mostly men objectifying women right? when women objectify men it is seen as funny and cute and something "girls do."

hence my question about whether gay men objectify other men and whether the gay men who are objectified are offended by this.

frankly, most straight men I know DREAm of being objectified sexually by women. Whether it is dehumanizing or not does not matter to them, it is about the sexual urge. It just so happens that over the past centuries women are the "objects" of desire, wheras men are the ones seeking to snare/woo/court these "objects"

mass media allows for a very unhealthy overexposure of the female body as an object of desire. sex sells everything.

[knox]

I don't think you understand what objectifying means.

[Rob Instigator]

it means more than one thing. what do YOU mean by objectifying?

[amerikangod]

My sense of humor in real life tends to be a little bit more varied than it is on here, although it is still frequently dark and highly sexualized. I'd say my sense of humor has come from several sources. Like most senses of humor, they develop as a method of coping with the world around you. Part of it has always been with me, since I was a little kid. I found a poetry book not too long ago, collecting poems one of my grade school teachers made my entire class write over the course of a year. In one section we were instructed to write limmericks about a world leader. Everyone chose a president, mainly George Washington, Abe Lincoln, JFK, or Bush Sr. I chose Satan. I was just that kid.

I am also into degradation. In general. Self degradation, degradation of things others value, of the sacred, the whole spectrum. I don't like it when people take anything in life too seriously, especially themselves. I want everyone to be in on the big cosmic joke.

Thirdly, I am a straight, white male who was once christian. And I grew up in Brooklyn in the 80's and 90's, so I was never part of a sheltered majority. My entire life I have been told that I am the epitome of evil. As a straight person, I was responsible for intolerance towards homosexuals, as a white person, I was the entitled (I have never had money) devil that has subjugated and shit on all other races, that needs to pay for past crimes. As a male, I was the sexist pig that had treated women as inferior and exploited them. Culturally, I've never been allowed pride in anything that I am. And growing up, I was taught of all of the injustices in the world as if I was always the villain in the story. I came home from school once in second grade and told my mother that I hated white people. Honestly, I used to buy into all of the hate directed at me. And my point in saying this is certainly not to complain. I hate it when anyone whines about their condition, especially categorically. I am merely explaining that a portion of my sense of humor has come from recognizing all of this, becoming frustrated with it, and kicking back (so to speak.) Essentially, I like shitting on sensitivities, whether they be about race, gender, or sexual orientation. To me, the only way to work past them at this point is to not give a shit about them.

I had a point in bringing this up. But I'm sleepy and I'm still sick, so it's hard to focus. If I remember what it was, I'll come back later and post it.

Also, balls.

[Rob Instigator]

ob·jec·ti·fy

–verb (used with object),-fied, -fy·ing.
to present as an object, esp. of sight, touch, or other physical sense; make objective; externalize.

1. To present or regard as an object: "Because we have objectified animals, we are able to treat them impersonally" (Barry Lopez).
2. To make objective, external, or concrete: thoughts objectified in art.

[Rob Instigator]

Men are different from women in many respects. One of the ways, and this is drawn from just my experience, is that women tend to love with their brains as much as with their genitals. I would venture to say more men than women would have sex with someone that they did not like personally, but they enjoyed their physical attributes.

From talking to all the women I have known, they are far less likely to sex someone who they dislike. is this a result of males objectifying the female? maybe.

[amerikangod]

I think my point was that I'm just tired of the very sound of a black lesbian's voice as it is the epitome of whiny.

EDIT, for Glice:

 

[pbradley]

I know I have no idea what objectification means. In its technical sense, I think it's synonymous with reification. However, that's not how it is strictly used in sexual objectification as an object of physical pleasure is often idealized. I believe the original meaning of the concept of objectification in feminist philosophy obviously stems for existential philosophy which would make it a kind of bad faith imposed on others through the male gaze and social norms, etc. However, I don't know if that meaning has changed since then or if it gets muddied by how it is used elsewhere. In fact, I'm sure if I gave it enough though that I could trace it back to my general criticism of the genealogy of the subject/object.

[Better_Than_Deux]

Originally Posted by amerikangod

I hate it when anyone whines about their condition, especially categorically..

i wanted to rep you for that but it wouldnt let me.

so here are some public kudos

[Genteel Death]

I objectify men and think about having sex with some of them all the time. I'd do the same with women if I was straight. I just don't make it a habit of going on about it at any (non)given chance. Unless I am out with my friends and am in the mood for talking shit, in which case nobody cares anyway. I also get laid fairly regularly, so that might have something to with it. YEEAAAH CHECK DAT ASS!!

[space]

Originally Posted by amerikangod

I post here because it entertains me. When it stops entertaining me, I'll stop posting here.

yr'a fixin' ta make me cry. ''''''''''''''''''''''''''

[amerikangod]

Originally Posted by space

yr'a fixin' ta make me cry. ''''''''''''''''''''''''''

If you're so concerned with losing me, perhaps you should start showing more skin, no? Keep me happy with your God given gifts. They were given to you for a purpose. And that purpose is sating my carnal desires.

^This is the only way I know how to say 'I love you' that doesn't involve a facial.

[Glice]

Originally Posted by amerikangod

I think my point was that I'm just tired of the very sound of a black lesbian's voice as it is the epitome of whiny.

EDIT, for Glice:

 

'You must spread some reputation around...' Shame.

[verme (prevaricator)]

no, i don't think there's anything shameful about what i think of women in particular, i'm not sexist. or at least i try not to be.

and no, KNOX, i don't think porn is inherently sexist or degrading, and i certainly do not endorse hidden female sexuality.

BUT,
this is an open forum and there should be some refrain from posting erotic content.
not because it might hurt susceptibilities, but because our porn man big gay rob has a shit taste.

HA!

i kid.
well, some of the nasty skunk you'll occasionaly post - all in good fun, i understand - has indeed caused intense disgust on me.

[knox]

I have never ever said that porn is necessarily sexist or degrading. Dont like general assumptions being made about my opinions either. Also, I never implied women have to hide their sexuality to be taken seriously (tho other people have). I dont agree with that either, so please dont make assumptions.