[SONIC GAIL]

Originally Posted by knox

Oh yes, I missed this part. What are my personal beliefs and my age? This should be fun.

If you say I am pro- same sex marriage and the right to abort that DOES NOT COUNT because I stated that clearly.

Yes, my point exactly. And for the record I do believe in teaching the use of condoms as well as teaching abstinance. If I didn't use them I would not of broken one would I?

I keep seeing the personal freedoms of kids mentioned in here. The personal freedoms are limited to the rules of thier parents and the government until they turn 18. And before some one assumes....I am not saying kids have no rights. Of course they are entitled to be taken care of and not abused, but the right of full choice is not thiers until they come of legal age.

[knox]

Not to be a bitch or anything, but 99% of the time condoms break when they aren't put on properly, which is something you could possibly learn in school. As well as the next day pill, that is also an option.

And as far as I'm aware is is not illegal to have consenting sexual intercourse before 18 with someone who is also under 18.

From the universal declaration of their rights:

Principle 7
The child is entitled to receive education, which shall be free and compulsory, at least in the elementary stages. He shall be given an education which will promote his general culture and enable him, on a basis of equal opportunity, to develop his abilities, his individual judgement, and his sense of moral and social responsibility, and to become a useful member of society.
The best interests of the child shall be the guiding principle of those responsible for his education and guidance; that responsibility lies in the first place with his parents.
The child shall have full opportunity for play and recreation, which should be directed to the same purposes as education; society and the public authorities shall endeavour to promote the enjoyment of this right.

Principle 10
The child shall be protected from practices which may foster racial, religious and any other form of discrimination. He shall be brought up in a spirit of understanding, tolerance, friendship among peoples, peace and universal brotherhood, and in full consciousness that his energy and talents should be devoted to the service of his fellow men.

So, unlike you are saying, children ARE entitled of their own beliefs. They should be, at least, according to this.

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by knox

And as far as I'm aware is is not illegal to have consenting sexual intercourse before 18 with someone who is also under 18.

So if I fuck a 17 year old in the US, I get done for having overage sex?

[Savage Clone]

Yet another set of problems that my Universal Human Sterilization Plan would fix.

[SONIC GAIL]

Originally Posted by knox

Not to be a bitch or anything, but 99% of the time condoms break when they aren't put on properly, which is something you could possibly learn in school. As well as the next day pill, that is also an option.

And as far as I'm aware is is not illegal to have consenting sexual intercourse before 18 with someone who is also under 18.

From the universal declaration of their rights:

Principle 7
The child is entitled to receive education, which shall be free and compulsory, at least in the elementary stages. He shall be given an education which will promote his general culture and enable him, on a basis of equal opportunity, to develop his abilities, his individual judgement, and his sense of moral and social responsibility, and to become a useful member of society.
The best interests of the child shall be the guiding principle of those responsible for his education and guidance; that responsibility lies in the first place with his parents.
The child shall have full opportunity for play and recreation, which should be directed to the same purposes as education; society and the public authorities shall endeavour to promote the enjoyment of this right.

Principle 10
The child shall be protected from practices which may foster racial, religious and any other form of discrimination. He shall be brought up in a spirit of understanding, tolerance, friendship among peoples, peace and universal brotherhood, and in full consciousness that his energy and talents should be devoted to the service of his fellow men.

So, unlike you are saying, children ARE entitled of their own beliefs. They should be, at least, according to this.

I was tought how to use a condom at the STD awareness class I attended in 6th grade where they also emphasized abstinance.

Nice google work there. UN

I never said they were not entitled to thier own beliefs. I am talking about actions. While I do believe that it is great for kids to come up with thier own way of viewing things, I also believe that when you are a kid you are very vulnerable and trusting. Kids need to be taken care of, hence they don't have the freedom to put all of these ideas into motion because some of the ideas are harmfull to themselves as well as others.

And you do notice that it says BEST INTEREST OF THE CHILD right?

Does a 10 year old have a right to choose to drive a car down the freeway because of free choice? I garantee if you have a couple of 8 year olds fucking and there will be problems. I'm sorry, but as much as I thought I had the right to have sex when I was 16 I WAS WRONG. I did not. I was just a little girl who thought it was cool and could have gotten myself into a lot of trouble. It was not my right to choose. My parents had my best interest in mind when they said I should not.

[knox]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

So if I fuck a 17 year old in the US, I get done for having overage sex?

yes, weird isn't it. i knew this boy who had a boyfriend, and when his boyfriend turned 18 and he was still 17 his parents decided to put his boyfriend in jail. LOL. fuck. ruined the guys life.

and sonic gail, they emphasized abstinence but IT DIDNT WORK DID IT. It just doesn't work, kids will do it anyway, like you did. There was nothing someone could have said or done that would have stopped you and your curiosity and your hormones. if they had emphasized how to properly put a condom on and the next morning pill or birth control pills perhaps you wouldn't be so bitter about getting pregnant early now.

you can drive a car at 16 can't you? you can vote can't you? how would they want you to not to fuck? surely driving a car and voting need more maturity over the lives of others than just having a 16 year old fuck.

i dont think its the best interest of a child to be repressed and misinformed.

and by the way, i had good ones back then. I was on the pill as well as condoms, just for safety you know, and guess what IT WORKED.

[SONIC GAIL]

Originally Posted by knox

and sonic gail, they emphasized abstinence but IT DIDNT WORK DID IT. if they had emphasized how to properly put a condom on and the next morning pill perhaps you wouldn't be so bitter.

you can drive a car at 16 can't you? you can vote can't you? how would they want you to not to fuck? surely driving a car and voting need more maturity over the lives of others than just having a 16 year old fuck.

i dont think its the best interest of a child to be repressed and misinformed.

and by the way, i had good ones back then. I was on the pill as well as condoms, just for safety you know, and guess what IT WORKED.

You are repeating yourself. Repressed and misinformed...and I have to keep saying I believe in both. Also, I just wrote that I took the class on how to put on condoms so I don't know why you keep saying that over and over. And guess what? The morning after pill was not even released back in the day. Oh sorry you might be to young to remember the big controversy over that thing. You know killing eggs and such.

I did'nt get pregnant untill 3 years after I got married so yeah it did work. You say that I judge you and then tell me I am bitter because I got pregnant unexpectedly? After I got over my SELFISH want to keep doing what I wanted instead of my new CHILD'S RIGHT TO BE BORN (we forget this right alot don't we)I was quite happy to have my SECOND child.

16 year olds cannot vote. and I did not drive untill I was 17 because of "My right to choose what I want to do" I did stupid shit with the car and was not allowed to. I made a good CHOICE huh?

And good for you. I'm glad it worked. Both methods seem to do well, as I have been saying all along.

[knox]

They didn't have birth control pills? Sorry I don't usually live in countries where killing eggs is a big problem, so I don't recall. But, just to be anal, it isn't an egg the day after.

Look, you're obviously pro-life or whatever they call it and I´m pro the right to abort so this is going to be extremely pointless.

I just happen to know you can't stop teenagers from doing what they want, the best you can do is hope they can protect themselves properly.

If they don't feel like they are going to be judged, they might ask their parents and families for help in birth control and ask questions. If they are being told they won't ask anyone anything, out of fear. Simple as that.

You said youself that you had sex at 16, so you know the mentioning abstinence didn't work at all for you. It doesn't work for most of them. Do you know why? Because it's natural that we want to discover sex at that age, we can't help ourselves in most cases.

You don't have to mention abstinence in school, because surely kids already get that pressure at home, they just need a place where their real concerns will be tackled without judgement.

[SONIC GAIL]

Originally Posted by knox

They didn't have birth control pills? Sorry I don't usually live in countries where killing eggs is a big problem, so I don't recall. But, just to be anal, it isn't an egg the day after. Sorry to confuse, thought you were refering to the morning after pill (it was not approved in the US for years even though many other European countries used it). I think this is a great method in emergency situations. Birth control pills are very effective in my opinion. I was on them at the age of 15 and stayed on them for years. My mom taught me both. She was full blown Catholic as you get. She emphasized abstinance though. Now I understand why. That is the one most precious gift that I could not give my husband because of my mistakes in the past. And yes birth control helped those mistakes not cause catastrpohies.

Look, you're obviously pro-life or whatever they call it and I´m pro the right to abort so this is going to be extremely pointless.Wrong. Please do not categorize me with people that murder others because they think they are murderers. I am in no way signed up for the Pro life bumpersticker. I believe people do have a right to choose the operation according to our constitution, however personally I believe the child has a right to a chance, and should not be treated as a way out. In my opinion it is the right thing to do in some circumstances. Sometimes no life is more humane than a shitty one. 2 of my closest family members have had abortions, I judge them not. It was thier choice and none of my fucking business.

I just happen to know you can't stop teenagers from doing what they want, the best you can do is hope they can protect themselves properly. Right. That is what my mom did and I believe as well. Provide them with the best knowledge you can and hope they make the right choices.

If they don't feel like they are going to be judged, they might ask their parents and families for help in birth control and ask questions. If they are being told they won't ask anyone anything, out of fear. Simple as that. I agree this is an important factor in the choices that children make. That is why you approach them with loving advice not judgemental advice. I don't believe the "your going to hell if you have sex" advice works.

You said youself that you had sex at 16, so you know the mentioning abstinence didn't work at all for you. It doesn't work for most of them. Do you know why? Because it's natural that we want to discover sex at that age, we can't help ourselves in most cases. You don't know why I did it. I did it because I was under the impression from society that, that is what you do to get love from some one. More and more kids today are having sex at an earlier age. If you only tell them to use these magic birth control products and don't even mention the fact that they could go with the most obvious method, many take it as a free ticket to do whatever they want with no self control. It does work for some and that counts.

You don't have to mention abstinence in school, because surely kids already get that pressure at home, they just need a place where their real concerns will be tackled without judgement. School is here to educate in more than one manner. I was a kid once and remember the misconceptions about sex you learn on a school bus. Believe me there are some kids out there that need it spelled out to them.

Please see above:

[floatingslowly]

Originally Posted by Savage Clone

Yet another set of problems that my Universal Human Sterilization Plan would fix.

fuck that!

I wouldn't even be off the table before the wife would start telling her friends about how she had me "fixed" "like a cat".

besides, what would I do if my next wife also wanted a genius-child????

[Savage Clone]

I don't know. First you have to find someone smart enough to pass along DNA of a similar caliber to whatever genes girlgun gave the first kid.

[knox]

Once again, abstinence is a personal choice not a scientific fact to be included in any school curriculum.

And you do understand I was talking about what I've been reading that many schools in the US were teaching abstinence ONLY and having kids taking virginity pledges. lol.

 

[pbradley]

Obviously we should chemically castrate our youth until we choose to have grandchildren.

[SONIC GAIL]

Originally Posted by knox

And you do understand I was talking about what I've been reading that many schools in the US were teaching abstinence ONLY and having kids taking virginity pledges. lol.

 

That's wrong I agree. I myself have not encountered any schools with such standards. Nice debate. I rather enjoyed it. You should think about going into politics. You're relentless. Truce ok.

[knox]

I can't go into politics, I care too much about people.

[chicka]

wow a debate without name calling what gives????

[Rob Instigator]

All religions make me wanna throw up
All religions make me sick
All religions make me wanna throw up
All religions suck
They all claim that they have the truth
That'll set you free
Just give 'em all your money and they'll set you free
Free for a fee

They all claim that they have 'the Answer'
When they don't even know the Question
They're just a bunch of liars
They just want your money
They just want your consciousness

[Chorus]
All religions suck
All religions make me wanna throw up
All religions suck
All religions make me wanna BLEAH

They really make me sick
They really make me sick
They really make me sick
They really make me sick
They really make me sick
They really make me ILL

[Keeping It Simple]

Originally Posted by knox

I can't go into politics, I care too much about people.

You're a commie?!

[knox]

yes i eat abortions for dinner.???


seriously how old are you.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

I did not want to have a religion thread specifically, if anything i didn't want to talk about religion at all, rather the cultural and historical bullshit we self-servingly masquerade as religion

Churches attacked in Malaysia






Three churches have been damaged in a firebomb attack in Malaysia's capital Kuala Lumpur, causing religious tensions to escalate after a court decision allowed non-Muslims to use the word Allah to refer to God.
The attacks have been condemned by Prime Minister Najib Razak who said that such actions would "destroy our country's harmony".

READ MORE: Churches attacked in Kuala Lumpur

This sad occurence is an interesting manifestation of cultural baggage masquerading as religion. Malaysia is a muslim country, but it is not Arab. While the huge population of Muslims do not generally speak Arabic, of course God is "Allah". However proper Islam requires at least a vague familiarity with Arabic..

anyways Christians in Malaysia (not just missionaries, but Malaysian Christians) are using Allah as a name for the God of the Christian Bible, the Father of Jesus Christ. This has been a legal issue in the country where such actions are legally prohibited and even criminally seditious . But this is NOT Islam, this is a cultural quark of Malaysian muslims.

In places like Egypt, Israel, Palestine, Jordan, Syria, long standing Christian communities, some of which are the oldest continuous Christians in the world, who are the originators of much of the beliefs of Christianity in general, use the Arabic word "Allah" for God the Father of the Christian Trinity,as these folks are often either ethnic Arabs or speak Arabic as a primary language. There is not the same backlash as in Malaysia, because in places like Syria or Jordan Christians are a sizeable portion of the population, and even in Egypt, where they are an extreme minority, Copts have a relative degree of freedom. The Egyptian government does not sieze Coptic bibles or Agpeya prayer books for references of God as "Allah". If anything, muslims in the middle east are rather respective of the "people of the book" aspect of Islam, which has mutual respect for Christians and Jews.