[Severian]

Yeah, I kinda like the title of his thread though.

[Severian]

You know what? We didn't even cover Prince's death in the paper. I mean, we included literally nothing about his passing. Granted, the news didn't break until right around the time that Thursday's edition was going to print. But we didn't put anything in the next day's edition, nothing I saw anyway. I don't work on the entertainment section, but I Proof most pages, and I didn't see a word all week.

We have David Bowie a full page spread and two AP stories (it's a small town paper, so nobody has the time to write about national news), and even Lemmy got a ½ page below, under the fold.

[themawt71]

shake your body like a horn pony would

[Severian]

Originally Posted by pepper_green

fuck that shit. dude's a piss ant.

you were the one who went postal on me in that thread, for making some fairly well-articulated points about religion and identity.

What the fuck was that about anyway greezy? I wasn't even arguing with you.

[louder]

I already miss Prince so much. :'(

[louder]

 

 

[Severian]

Me too. I think this may be hitting me harder than Bowie.

[Genteel Death]

https://soundcloud.com/year-of-the-lips/prince-mix-rip

[tesla69]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...addiction.html

If this story is true it totally blows the myth that people on opiates can't do anything and seems to indicate it was the tylenol the pharmas mix in with the meds, like they force you to die slowly in order to escape pain.

I'm kind of not believing this.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by tesla69

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...addiction.html

If this story is true it totally blows the myth that people on opiates can't do anything and seems to indicate it was the tylenol the pharmas mix in with the meds, like they force you to die slowly in order to escape pain.

I'm kind of not believing this.

"Doctor D's" knowledge of opiate pharmacology is shaky at best.

He speaks with the authority of a grandstanding know it all with only experiential knowledge and dimmed down second/third/fourth hand explanations how how these chemicals interact.

For instance. This quote is particularly irritating:

"'Also if they did have to give him a save shot when he overdosed like everybody is saying - that removes all traces of drugs from your system so he would have started to go into withdrawal and would have had to take a lot of drugs to feel okay again - which also could have killed him."

This is not actually true. "Save shots" are Narcan (noloxone), which is used to pull people out of an overdose before their lungs shut down so they can be properly intubated.

Narcan absolutely DOES NOT "remove all traces" of opiate from your system. It TEMPORARILY blocks the opiate's effect on the body by binding to opioid neurotransmitters to block the synapses and "pull" someone out of their OD. It does NOT get rid of the opiates in a person's system. In fact, all it really does is mask their effect for a very temporary period of time.

Honestly, what this guy's saying is complete horseshit. Indeed it sends an overdose victim into a temporary state of withdrawal, but the drugs stay in your system and the effects of opiates (all opiates) last MUCH longer than the brief interruption Narcan produces.

In fact, people die of overdoses after receiving Narcan injections because when the drug wears off, in fifteen or twenty minutes, the person goes right back to being high as fuck. If it removed all traces of the drug from your system it would be a goddamn miracle drug and essentially do all the work of a 1-3 week detox in one simple shot.

This is from some fucking drug website:

After injecting naloxone, stay with the person and watch for continued signs of overdose. You may need to give another injection every 2 to 3 minutes until emergency help arrives. Follow all medication instructions carefully.

Every two to three minutes! That's because the shit is a last ditch emergency effort, and only works for a very short time. Ideally, buying you enough time for the EMT's to arrive.

I fucking hate drug people. They talk with this streetwise authority but they have no fucking clue what they're actually talking about. It's all myth making and hyperbole to them because they're all goddamn self-absorbed pricks who are stuck with an 18 year old mentality.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if this asshole just wanted to hear himself Fucking talk. "Doctor D" ... my ass. And look, his moronic "expert opinion" is now national news.

He's acting like the Narcan removed Prince's tolerance, making him extra vulnerable to overdose when he took his next dose. That's not how it works. Fucker would still be high as a kite after the Narcan ran its course, would still have a tolerance, and if anything his next dose would actually take MORE opiates to get him high because with any remnant of Narcan in your system, you have to take extra in order to compensate for the residual blocking effect of the opiate.

What a goddamn idiot.

[Severian]

I don't find it hard to believe that Prince had a habit. Most human beings do, whether it's to alcohol (2 drinks a day? Addict. Drink alone? Addict) or prescription pills, or whatever. Many people aren't even aware of the fact that their ambien or klonipin is habit forming. Just as many people don't think of their 3-5 beers after work at Friday's "count" as problem drinking. But the body doesn't care whether you're living responsibly or not. If you're putting addictive chemicals into your body, you eventually develop a dependency or an addiction. That's just how it is.

So I don't find it hard to believe that Prince had painkiller problem. Have you guys ever taken dilauded or fentanyl? I mean, shit... Opiates are objectively awesome, and they feel amazing. I can totally understand how and why someone would get hooked if they had the money to keep it going nonstop.

I'm even willing to buy that an overdose did him in. Why not? Why is it hard to believe this about Prince, but easy to accept with Michael Jackson, Kurt Cobain, Heath Ledger, Jeff Tweedy, everyone in Aerosmith, Guns n Roses and the Rolling Stones, Sid and Nancy and Davis and Coltrane and Any Winehouse, and on and on and on.. They're people! Prince was a person! He lied and fucked up just like everyone else.

What does it matter, is my question. Drugs or no drugs, the man is dead. Does this somehow make it less heartbreaking? Fuck you if you say yes. If Prince was a narcotics addict, then he was suffering in ways most people won't ever be able to imagine for a quarter century. Even if he did it silently. It's sad as hell, no matter what happened. Prince is dead, and that fucking sucks.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

I don't believe Prince was a conventional addict IF these rumors turn out to be true. He was so notoriously straight edge just doesn't feel right. If he was indeed using prescription opiates I'm willing to wager he used them more carefully than typical addicts. He strikes me aa one who was using them legitimately for pain management. Hestrikes me as the kind of disciplined person who would avoid addiction as a matter of his personality. HOWEVER that doesn't mean even taking opiates in a purely medicinal way didn't take his life.

This narrative that he was abusing pills i find in poor taste. That just isn't Prince even if it 99% of other people. I find it sad that TMZ will try and destroy yet another legacy. TMZ is pathetic. They have no shame. They are absolutely slime. Worthless. Trash.

Prince legacy will survive this interlude of nonsense. Even if toxicology comes back opiates it DOESN'T mean he was an addict. MJ admitted to being an addict. His crooked "doctors" admitted such. I just don't buy it for Prince. If opiates contributed to his death i say it wasn't addiction, it was classic side effects or accident. NOT a recreational OD.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

I don't believe Prince was a conventional addict IF these rumors turn out to be true. He was so notoriously straight edge just doesn't feel right. If he was indeed using prescription opiates I'm willing to wager he used them more carefully than typical addicts. He strikes me aa one who was using them legitimately for pain management. Hestrikes me as the kind of disciplined person who would avoid addiction as a matter of his personality. HOWEVER that doesn't mean even taking opiates in a purely medicinal way didn't take his life.

This narrative that he was abusing pills i find in poor taste. That just isn't Prince even if it 99% of other people. I find it sad that TMZ will try and destroy yet another legacy. TMZ is pathetic. They have no shame. They are absolutely slime. Worthless. Trash.

Prince legacy will survive this interlude of nonsense. Even if toxicology comes back opiates it DOESN'T mean he was an addict. MJ admitted to being an addict. His crooked "doctors" admitted such. I just don't buy it for Prince. If opiates contributed to his death i say it wasn't addiction, it was classic side effects or accident. NOT a recreational OD.

Well, I'm not sure why you're so skeptical, and it seems as though you might be kind of idealizing and individual you didn't know just because you like his music... BUT I kind of agree. People who are out of control opiate addicts don't live productive and fruitful lives without ever letting anyone catch on, or slipping up in a way that reveals their secret.

That said, Prince was notoriously private and if we're talking about him as a human being, which he was, then there's no real reason to give him any extra benefit of the doubt simply because it "doesn't feel right." But again, it doesn't really feel right to me either.

The way that Doctor D talks about dilaudid too... Like it's somehow not a narcotic? That it "gives you an energy burst?" All opiates tend to give a "burst" to people who suffer from pain, because they help the pain, and cause euphoria. All of them. And seasoned users/addicts get a boost from it because it makes their violent withdrawal stop.

But dilaudid is just a souped up version of morphine. It's not some magical drug that hits you like meth and heroin at the same time. If Prince was doing large doses of it (or Fentanyl, which is strong as hell and knocks even the toughest users on their asses) he would have been showing clear signs of opiate abuse. He would have been nodding, would have had pinpoint pupils, would have acted drunk... That's not how he acted. Kurt Cobain acted like a drug addict. Prince was a technical wizard and a razor sharp artistic machine until the very end.

Again I'm totally willing to buy that he used drugs. I'm even willing to buy that he was an addict. But I'm not buying what this Doctor D is selling, so to speak. He's a goddamn moron and should not be considered a credible source.

Also that article was written by an amateur punk bitch.
And TMZ is the AIDS of media journalism.

[Severian]

But no matter what happened, it's not going to change my opinion of Prince. Whether it was drugs or illness or whatever. Who cares? The point is that a legend has died. The details and circumstances surrounding his death are irrelevant to the man's legacy, and have no bearing on the incredible music he made over the past 35+ years.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Severian

Well, I'm not sure why you're so skeptical, and it seems as though you might be kind of idealizing and individual you didn't know just because you like his music... BUT I kind of agree.

that is the thing i actually don't really listen to any of Prince's music even though i probably should. Its Prince the PERSON i am a fan of and so i know mpre about him personally than i do his immense catalogue of music.
And what i know is Prince was notorious for throwing the wildest parties and yet never being even remotely out of control. Those who knew him in private always noted how disciplined and serious he was. And he was notoriously straight edge. That is why being even a pill addict just doesn't feel right to me. It doesn't mean its impossible i in particular wouldn't be one to judge or misunderstand an addiction. However for Prince it fits more into his known character and personality that if he did die from opiates that it was a genuine accident or complication from otherwise legit pain management therapy which is known to happen. Opiates are dangerous in general even for nonaddicts

[Severian]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

that is the thing i actually don't really listen to any of Prince's music even though i probably should. Its Prince the PERSON i am a fan of and so i know mpre about him personally than i do his immense catalogue of music.
And what i know is Prince was notorious for throwing the wildest parties and yet never being even remotely out of control. Those who knew him in private always noted how disciplined and serious he was. And he was notoriously straight edge. That is why being even a pill addict just doesn't feel right to me. It doesn't mean its impossible i in particular wouldn't be one to judge or misunderstand an addiction. However for Prince it fits more into his known character and personality that if he did die from opiates that it was a genuine accident or complication from otherwise legit pain management therapy which is known to happen. Opiates are dangerous in general even for nonaddicts

That they are. And I hope you're right, but for me, it wouldn't tarnish his reputation or his legacy, even if it came out that he was a straight up junkie. But I don't think that's the case.

Anyway. Long story short, RIP Prince.

[tesla69]

Originally Posted by Severian

Why is it hard to believe this about Prince, but easy to accept with Michael Jackson, {SNIP} Any Winehouse, and on and on and on..

I simply always thought he was into women and sex and lots of sex and never bothered with drugs due to his religion and the fact he was too busy having lots of sex with Vanity and Sheila E and Sheena Easton and so on and also 100% concerned with writing and playing music.

[The Soup Nazi]

 

From fellow Mpls comrades-in-arms:

I never spoke with Prince. He always struck me as a private guy. Maybe he was shy around strangers. We never had much actual interaction – a couple nods in passing, but no real words were exchanged.

The Twin Cities of the 1980s was a very special time for all of us local musicians. There were the North Minneapolis R&B artists, the South Minneapolis guitar rock bands, and in the center of it all was First Avenue/7th Street Entry.

I’ve seen Prince perform sold out shows with The Revolution at First Ave, he and a rhythm section jamming as a guitar/bass/drums three piece in the Entry for 30 people, and was selfishly frustrated when he took over “the main room” for 25 days of filming Purple Rain.

I had the pleasure of spending seven days recording the basic tracks for my first solo album at Paisley Park in December 1988. It was the most professional studio I had ever seen at that point in my life. On the seventh day, I moved from the B room to Studio A, which was Prince’s primary room. I remember seeing Sheila E’s percussion in one of the isolation booths. The large control room was decorated with several of Prince’s scarves. It certainly felt like Prince’s home.

Prince was an artist through and through – always pushing himself to new levels, often creating controversy through his actions and words, and ultimately creating a lifetime of wonderful memories for the world with his incredible volumes of published (and unheard) works.

I heard the news while driving from Tomah WI to Minneapolis. I immediately flipped on The Current 89.3 FM to make sure what I was hearing was true. Sure enough, there was a live report from outside Paisley Park confirming the sad news of Prince’s passing.

I’m two blocks from First Avenue as I write these words. Friday and Saturday nights, I will walk that same stage we all know from the movie. The exterior walls of First Avenue are covered with stars to honor the musicians who made an impact on music fans in Minnesota.

Make no mistake: Prince was the brightest star in these Northern skies. My deepest condolences to his family, friends, and fellow musicians. Prince’s music will give consolation and comfort to the collective grief. Godspeed.

—Bob Mould

Bob Mould with the Suicide Commandos - "When U Were Mine" (First Avenue, Minneapolis, MN, April 22, 2016)

You hear it so often: "It's such a shock." And for once, I truly am [in shock]. It's hard to even believe. I guess it's just a reminder of how fragile we all are and how quick life is. A lot of people have been calling wondering how I feel, like somehow this is going to spill over and I'm going to drop over. Tommy [Stinson] sent me a text that was like, "Holy shit, can you believe Rog is gone?

I immediately went back to the first times we saw him and all the times we sort of grew up around him. He went to school five, six blocks away from where I was born. So we walked the same streets. But I didn't know about him until he was already the man. It was probably just right before the Replacements, right as we were getting together. I think it was his first hit, "I Wanna Be Your Lover," which ironically, was never a hit here at home. I remember reading about it, that there was a guy from Minneapolis who had a huge hit. But it wasn't played here. I must have been about 19 at the time, and I bought the record and I loved it. It was like everything that we weren't doing. You know, melodies, and slick and simple and perfect. We were full of the punk stuff at the time. It sort of put us in perspective, like, "OK, we'll go as far as we can with our limited talent, but this is the real deal. This guy is the real shit." He would be playing First Avenue when we would be playing the Seventh Street Entry, the little 100-capacity club that connected, and he was in the big room with 900 people. It was night and day. We had our little thing, but occasionally, when we were playing, and he would come in the room for three seconds, walk out and the entire room would empty, following him. I hope he did it on purpose. I think maybe he did. Hey, he was a star. There was no doubt about it.

My first recollection of seeing him was a dress rehearsal for one of his early tours. I was next to another musician, a couple other guys that were up-and-comers and that thought they were hot shit, and we were watching Prince. The guy turned to me and said, "I'm fucking embarrassed to be alive." And that's how I felt. He was so good. It was like, "What are we doing? This guy is, like, on a different planet than we are." It was showmanship, it was rock & roll, it was fun, it was great. I think it helped everyone around. It made us all think that Minneapolis wasn't the dour town that we tried to pretend it was. He was like a ray of light in a very cautious place. He was a star. He made no bones about it. He was glitz to a place that wasn't used to it. I remember a little scuffle broke out in front of the stage one night and Prince said, "Stop fighting, you'll mess up your clothes."

The first time I met him was at a urinal at a nightclub in St. Paul. There he was, and I said, "Hey, what's up?" And he answered, "Life." One word: "life." And I can't say that we went on to be pals. But we did record a lot at Paisley Park, and he became comfortable enough to grace us with his presence, not bejeweled and not dressed up. He'd be wearing maybe his jammies and sweat pants or maybe a pear of jeans and sneakers. He could sort of just hang out. He may have been a little more normal than he would've liked people to know. That's the treasure that we got, to be able to sit in the big atrium where you're taking a break and Prince shuffles by in his slippers and makes some popcorn in the microwave. My sister's a disc jockey, and he would pass by and say, "Tell your sister hi for me." People like to paint him as a reclusive this or that; I think he was genuinely truly, truly shy. But one thing says a lot about him: I was there making a solo record a few years later, and I got a message that said that my friend had just died. I was truly rattled, and the next time I went back into the studio, he had filled it up with balloons. Now I'm gonna cry.

I've spent more time with Bob Dylan, and I've got to say that I was more in awe of Prince. I can't think of anyone better – an all-around composer, musician, guitarist, star, showman, the whole package, anyone better. If Elvis wrote all of his songs and played guitar, it still wouldn't quite be there. He'd play Jimi Hendrix-style, between his legs and behind his back. And then he'd do the splits. He could put the guitar down, and Jimi would become James Brown. He could hold the crowd like Mick Jagger, but could Mick Jagger play the piano like that? And then, lyrically, there's something like, "When Doves Cry." There's obviously more going on there than meets the booty.

When I got word today, I was trying to write a song. I put it down. I found myself walking up to the store, and I bought myself a handful of colorful clothes. I was just drawn to do something that he would have done.

—Paul Westerberg

The Replacements - "I Could Never Take The Place Of Your Man" (St. Andrew's Hall, Detroit, MI, November 12, 1987)

Paul Westerberg talks about the passing of Prince (audio)

[The Soup Nazi]

 

From Wikipedia:

Purple Rain traded the #1 album chart position with Bruce Springsteen's Born in the U.S.A. twice, during 1984 and 1985.

Bruce Springsteen opens Brooklyn show with "Purple Rain" (April 23, 2016)

[The Soup Nazi]

"Why Should I Love You" - When Prince Met Kate Bush