The grand total of bands mentioned on this thread made a great contribution to how rock music is played, but of rock music solely we are still talking about, not exactly tradional Japanese music, which happens to be music too and ranges from the folk of minyo to shakuhachi, all with their own interesting variations that in the right hands have the potential to cross-pollinate western scales and non in good ways. Also, what about the use of instruments and influences from continents such as India etc in pop and rock music? Are they any inferior to what happens in Japanese rock music? I think not.

[Toilet & Bowels]

when i saw the boredoms play in london 4 years ago people were queuing around the block to get tickets.

and there's no way in hell 75 or 80% of people in japan can speak english. and the japanese girls who are into westerers are a small minority who go and hang out in certain touristy bars. average japanese girls have 0 interest in white guys. also, mathrock is not mainstream in japan at all, mainstream music in japan is some of the most horrible saccharine crap you'll ever hear in your life.
maybe you should go there before you start acting like you know the place?

Originally Posted by Nefeli

i know its lame but i wish for a site with japanese lyrics written with latin letters, so i can sing along. at least as a first step. after that i might wanna more like understanding what the lyrics are about. anyway, i think there are more japanese songs that i d like to sing along than english ones..

Japanese singing in English are the best with the exception, maybe, of Fela Kuti's use of the language.

[Everyneurotic]

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

... I mean, they're certainly more well-known here in American in 2008 than.. um.. Throwing Muses or something.. That's a completely off-the-wall example... ignore that.

you're talking about a band that's incredibly closely associated with a label that's considered to be defined and over by the end of the 80's (early 90's tops) compared to a band that's not only still contemporary but also ahead of it's time in a way.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

...One of Matt Groening's favorite bands is Boredoms! (he also wrote an essay about his love of Trout Mask Replica -- he's a cool guy)

he also wrote a fake residents biography.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

Also, Boredoms have been covered in every single major U.S. publication multiple times.

i insist, boredoms fans tend to be rock writers/critics, so of course they are going to find a way to get to write about them.

the thing, you hardly meet somebody who knows onanie bomb meets the sex pistols or can recognize between songs or know one of their side projects other than OOIOO, yet they can tell you they love chocolate synthetizer and eye and yoshimi. i mean, i think what i'm trying to say it's that there's a difference between being very well known and actually being big (at least sonic youth like big). like i said before, they have their fans, lots of them, but the bulk aren't that much of fans as much as casual approving listeners.

If you get bored sometimed, go to last.fm and see how many plays Boredoms have.. it may shock you.

also, keep in mind they have albums that have a lot of short songs, go see how many plays anal cunt have.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

And, Melt-Banana, I mean, the touring with Tool and the appearance of Perfect Hair Forever has cemented them as a pretty large band as well. Not large enough where they don't play house shows, but EVERYONE who is into music that's below the "mainstream" barrier a bit knows who they are.

masonna opened for slipknot, he is still not a household name outside people who listen to noise.

and i really doubt people who are into, say, clap your hands say yeah know who melt-banana are.

then again, they are playing here and they are playing in a huge cabaret-like venue. what i said before, from my observations, is that people who love noise, noise rock and avant garde shit love them, and the punks and metalheads who know them love them, even if not all of them know them, so i can see a good size crowd in there.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

At least that's how it is in Indiana... can't speak for the rest of the U.S....

indiana seems to be pretty enlightened, more than, say, spain from what i've seen.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

But certainly there's a huge scene for "Japanese music" over here. At that Polysics show I went to a few months back in Ohio, GO!GO!7188 was mentioned by a middle-aged MOM that was there. This mom accompanying her daughter. And we got into this in-depth discussion and like 3 or 4 random people came up and started talking about them. It just blew my mind. "Jet ninjin!" Either she's the coolest mom ever or there are people who aren't just super-hip underground assholes like us who, y'know, appreciate good music from other places.

my mom loves later boredoms, fushitsusha, boris, bambi's dilemma, OOIOO, mono, otomo yoshihide, kousokuya, acid mothers temple, ruins and omoide hatoba, out of japanese rock music.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

On the other hand, will this music ever be big enough to get super-mainstream-success? Not likely, but look at Dir En Grey. They're fucking HUGE (in America!) and have very few words -- except "fuck" -- in English. Someone did make a point a few posts ago that a lot of Japanese musicians don't purely sing in English which probably equals mainstream failure, and I tend to agree with that. Most people, for some reason, don't like music with lyrics they can't understand. I guess that's understandable. I typically hate all lyrics so it's never bothered me much, but yeah. I can see that.

dir en grey's success is with anime/manga comicbook types and hot topic metal and goths who are into them because they are japanese and weird but not as weird as, say, the boredoms. it's like the 5, 6, 7, 8's song, a novelty for them to be into such a band. still, they are big with a few people and not a majority.

and people into anime and manga don't like underground stuff, they are into idoru, visua kei and all the mainstream shit that's big in japan. you know what band these people (and the japanese) consider an underground band? puffy amiyumi.

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

I'm going down to a convention in Florida next week and they always have tons of Japanese CD's and shit that sell like hot cakes. Even if most of that shit is visual kei shit... but yeah.. that whole scene is bigger than most of you think...

i think it's that lots of isolated pockets of people like them, and when a concert or a convention occurs, these people get together and realize there's more than you think. but how many are really fanatical about these bands and how many are just there because it's something to do is what's being debated here.

reminds me, last year when otomo yoshihide came here and played with fred frith, gael garcia bernal came to see them, acting like a big shot; by the end of the show, people were flocking to him for autographs and crap while otomo was packing his pedals and guitar by himself.

(awesome dude, have fun).

[uhler]

my brother's friends (who like anime and manga) go to those coventions and come back with j-pop cds. they never heard of the boredoms before until i played it for them and they didn't like it, but they sure love their j-pop. i don't think they're big like sonic youth, but i'm sure in other areas of the usa they are bigger than in florida.

[Toilet & Bowels]

Originally Posted by uhler

my brother's friends (who like anime and manga) go to those coventions and come back with j-pop cds.

those type of people annoy me, they will listen to the worst shit imaginable just because the singing is in japanese, the japanese equivalents to n sync or nickelback or whatever (who are about 1 zillion times worse than n sync or nickelback).

[atsonicpark]

Toilet and Bowels... Their rock bands are more complex than our rock bands here... unless we're talking about garage rock bands or something... When talking about mainstream in general, yeah, j-pop and shit is beyond sugar coated shit but .. uh, I wasn't talking about that.

I probably agree with your point regarding Asian chicks, and that's why I said "the ones frequenting bars." and noting I probably had no idea of what the average Japanese girl was like...

And I am not giving statistical evidence, I was venturing to guess 75-80% because EVERYONE IN JAPANESE SCHOOLS HAS TO LEARN ENGLISH. It's a requirement! That doesn't mean they can speak perfect English, that doesn't mean they understand our slang or whatever, but they HAVE TO learn a great deal of it.

...

Also, regarding those conventions, my girlfriend drags to 'em. I usually play smash brothers the whole time.

[Toilet & Bowels]

yeah, i know japanese people all supposedly study english in school, but try going over there and having a conversation, or even asking for the time or directions

[atsonicpark]

Hahaha.

[atsonicpark]

Oh, and something else I thought of while thinking of conventions...

I think the biggest (or at least most-heard) Japanese musician in America is Noubou Uematsu. (who does all the music for most of the Final Fantasy games, amongst other things)

[Glice]

Originally Posted by Toilet & Bowels

yeah, i know japanese people all supposedly study english in school, but try going over there and having a conversation, or even asking for the time or directions

Near-100% of British schoolkids learn a language other than English. I can say enough to get laid in French (apparently) but I'd be surprised if she thought I could hold down a conversation. I'd wager the same is true of a) our Japenese friends b) our British friends.

Not to be disparaging of either nation, or any nation, but teaching a language doesn't equate comprehension.

[Glice]

I'll add that the Chinese people I've met usually have adequate English to get by, at least, if not better - it's the system, not the fact of learning.

[Silent Dan Speaks]

I'd have to disagree about Indiana being enlightened, but maybe I've just lived here too long.

Anyway, seeing as how so many complain when they can't understand the words, I doubt Japanese music will ever be big in America.

[hat and bread]

Alls you have to do to make a non-English song a hit is rename it after a well known beef dish. Witness "Sukiyaki".

[hat and bread]

Originally Posted by hat and bread

Oh puh-fucking-leeeze! What a complete utter fucking crock of shit.
Get over yourselves 22 year old pock marked basement dwelling white males! Japanese women don't love you as much as you think they do!

Oh no! It's catching on in Latin America too!
Yellow fever threat cited in Paraguay

[atsonicpark]

Silent Dan Speaks -- Bloomington, Indiana. Very enlightened!

[mangajunky]

I was searching for something else and this topic came up.

There is currently a huge surge in J-rock and Visual Kei interest.

Pretty much every anime convention these days has a musical guest or two. They are playing to packed auditoriums. There are full-fledged tours of the USA by many J-rock and visual kei bands.

The biggest sign for all of you is the fact that X-Japan is playing Madison Square Garden on September 13, 2008.

http://www.japan-zone.com/news/2008/...e_garden.shtml

The invasion is here. You just run in different circles.

[Toilet & Bowels]

yeah, but the people who go to anime conventions will listen to anything that has japanese singing, like glay or dragon ash

[PAULYBEE2656]

fuck it.. who really gives a shit. if music is good then it will rise to the surface...regardless of its cultural roots..

i agree with people when they say japanese music is "different" to the american/english whatever but so is icelandic music. its their isolation, its their own imploded self centred culture (i dont mean that in a bad way, i mean they hold their culture very very dear) and thats something the western world should take a huge lesson from....

melts. boredoms, acid mothers, ruins, etc etc.... they are huge in ireland.. huge as say the youth and massive as say sebaodh is... massive in the music buyers market but go down to your local bang bang techno club and ask johnny scumbag is the feather float album a worthy successor to the super ae era boredoms and he will probably say "what the fuck are you on about gayboy" so everything is relative.....

we arent fooled into buying music, im speaking for myself but im sure the boot fits with majority of folk here, we are not a sponge to soak up the next crock of nickelback or razorshite muck that the media forces on our ipods, so the japanese invasion has taken over and is here to stay as far as my music world is concerned........

now where is my kiiiiiii album!

[Everyneurotic]

Originally Posted by mangajunky

...
The biggest sign for all of you is the fact that X-Japan is playing Madison Square Garden on September 13, 2008.

http://www.japan-zone.com/news/2008/...e_garden.shtml

...

yeah, how nuts is that?