[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

Fists. Words or theories don't work, violence is the only way to go. I've learned this lesson tonight, and it works. Punch a homophobe today.

nonsense, the only way to defeat a stereotype is positive exposure and reenforcement.

You must conquer hatred with love, and ignorance with experience.

Violence only begets violence, eye for an eye leaves us all blinded.

stand up for radical peace, based upon true and unfeigned love, for "there is no fear in love."

[Derek]

Man, you are such a hippie.


Take a shower.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Derek

Man, you are such a hippie.


Take a shower.

I resent that, I-man is no damned lazy-bones american yippie/hippie/dippie..

I may own hundreds of Grateful Dead bootleg recordings but I still resent that, I-man 100% Rastafari with no apologies, continual-I. seen?

[jon boy]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

I resent that, I-man is no damned lazy-bones american yippie/hippie/dippie..

I may own hundreds of Grateful Dead bootleg recordings but I still resent that, I-man 100% Rastafari with no apologies, continual-I. seen?

not a true rastafari though, you dont have the hair for it.

[Derek]

Sorry, the Grateful Dead bootlegs ruin your case.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by jon boy

not a true rastafari though, you dont have the hair for it.

ouch! even more so..
as the Rastaman say, "There is no hair doctrine."

[afterthefact]

I thought this said "Only way to fight homosexuals."

I was about to say, fists DO NOT work.

[greedrex]

Originally Posted by afterthefact

I thought this said "Only way to fight homosexuals."

I was about to say, fists DO NOT work.

depends how
you use
yr

fist.
yeah?
get it?
ha

[afterthefact]

Hey! That was MY joke! You took my joke, stripped it of it's subtlety, and reused it! NO FAIR!!!

[greedrex]

Originally Posted by afterthefact

H stripped it of it's subtlety,

it's not a joke, it's a fact.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

I would call it a fagt, but I'm afraid someone might hit me.

[Bertrand]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

I feel like shit. I don't like violence or being part of it. I feel rubbish for starting this thread. I wish I could delete it. You'll never understand what raising hands on a person makes me feel like.

I got sick at the army. We had just done our first shooting, using rifles on wooden still targets. Lieutenant came to me, said 9 of my 10 bullets had plugged the target. I went pale. He thought I was feeling terrible at the idea of not getting a 10 out of 10. It was not the case. It was so easy to pull the trigger. I just thought of the consequences. Had it been a human being. Just using your finger. I never could shoot properly again.

I understand it that way, your feeling rubbish, when you realise you can harm someone and feel no pain doing it.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

That guy was an asshole, and now he'll probably never act in the same manner again. I'm not sure how badly you clobbered him, but he wouldn't have learned his lesson otherwise.

You shouldn't beat yourself up over this (no pun intended). There's a big difference between kicking a little ass for a worthy cause and plugging a round into someone's chest.

Just my personal thoughts.

[Rob Instigator]

most homophobes are just trying to bury what they feel inside by raging at it on the outside.
That is my experience.

Fuck em. defending onesself or an innocent is always allowed.

"it’s what people know about themselves inside that makes 'em afraid". - High Plains Drifter

[tesla69]

The only problem is if this will teach him a lesson or piss him off to go look for a weaker person to assault. That's one of the problems with violence. But you are to be commended for standing up for yourself, have no regrets.

[afterthefact]

Originally Posted by tesla69

The only problem is if this will teach him a lesson or piss him off to go look for a weaker person to assault. That's one of the problems with violence. But you are to be commended for standing up for yourself, have no regrets.

I doubt he will do that. He probably thought that by picking on a gay dude, he was assaulting a weaker person, and he was totally taken by surprise. He won't make assumptions anymore about who is and isn't safe to pick on.

[Savage Clone]

Well, bullies will always look for another target, but that doesn't mean that you have to be that target. They certainly don't understand "reason" or "love power." This is the only language they speak, and you just have to know how to "speak" more eloquently in the vocabulary of the bully.
By which I of course mean humiliating him in front of his friends who will see him get his ass handed to him by an angry Italian queer.
Words only work with those who have the capacity to absorb them. The occasions when one is forced to physical confrontation as an adult should be rare, but there are times when that's all that is left.

[amerikangod]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

I feel like shit. I don't like violence or being part of it. I feel rubbish for starting this thread. I wish I could delete it. You'll never understand what raising hands on a person makes me feel like.

I actually don't have a problem with violence in its entirety. Or, to be more accurate, I have a big problem with large-scale violence, or the abuse of violence for the achievement of selfish ends (war, oppression, etc.), and unnecessary violence, but no problem with violence on a one-to-one level when it's a justified reaction.

I think people put way too much value on human life. Human life should absolutely be valued, and it is precious, and those that share these feelings and offer one another mutual respect should be greatly valued and protected. But human life in and of itself is not special. It's no more special than any other type of life, whether it be another intelligent member of the animal kingdom or a plant with no concious mind or self-awareness. That said, a human life isn't valuable by default. And the second a person chooses not to offer respect to their fellow persons, all of that morality (which exists in society purely as a tool for survival and mass cohabitation, but means shit in the natural world) goes out the window in my book. If someone threatens or hurts someone I love, or threatens a good, innocent person, then as far as I'm concerned they no longer deserve to be treated with this respect or their wellbeing deemed as valuable (that is for whatever duration they hold these attitudes or carry out these actions, as if a person sees the error in their ways and truly changes then I can forgive them.) This shared belief in individual value is an agreement, and if one party breaks that agreement it's perfectly fair to drop your end of the bargain.

At this point we're just talking about the natural world. We have it in us to be beasts, and if we are approached with savagery from another person, responding with savagery is a perfectly fair reaction. And I for one am prepared to be a more adept beast. It's not always the best reaction, mind you, and it's up to you to exercise proper judgement, but in any case, the best decision or not, it is a fair one.

Such ideas don't necessarily work with optimal results on a large scale (i.e. as a way for a government to operate), but can work one a one-to-one level.

That said, it is my opinion that you should have no regrets for your actions. You did the right thing.

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

nonsense, the only way to defeat a stereotype is positive exposure and reenforcement.

That's not true. It's one way to defeat a stereotype, depending on what the stereotype is, and given the right conditions (namely that the involved parties are even willing to exercise understanding and keep an open mind.) And you assume that he and his mate were targeted solely based on a stereotype. Some people just get off on dominating others around them, particularly if they feel inadequate in aspects of their own lives. It's a chance to be an alpha male, to feel power. And they picked them because they thought they could get away with it and without any repercussions. Now they realize it's not so easy, and with any luck they were at least jarred by the experience enough to take a second look.

The burden for change shouldn't be on the people subjected to discrimination. It's simply more fair to be hostile towards those who think they can get away with treating others poorly and continue to do so until they get with the system.

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

You must conquer hatred with love, and ignorance with experience.

Ignorance with experience, yes, but hatred is not conquered with love. Sometimes, yes, but with a lot of intense work and time. If a simple act of kindness is enough to turn a person around then they don't have hatred, they just have misguided anger that they've found a scapegoat for, which is two very different things. More often than not, genuine hatreds die along with the people that maintain them, and the next generation simply fills the void with new or less rigid perspectives.

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

Violence only begets violence, eye for an eye leaves us all blinded.

Violence doesn't always beget violence, but if you plan on being violent you should absolutely be prepared for more violence as it very well may come. Violence IS an answer, it just isn't always the best answer. But neither is extreme tolerance. Or love. Generally, a well-executed and thought-out blend of the two is ideal. And, at the very least, a capacity for violence is always a good thing. You can choose never to use it for as long as you live, but the ability to mete it out and to do so with skill is beneficial to anyone.


ALL OF THAT SAID, ANOTHER GREAT WAY TO FIGHT HOMOPHOBIA:
Really, really hot ladyboys. Have any of you guys seen Mig on ladyboyplayer.com? God damn. I'm not even remotely gay (I've long considered it just in case I was bisexual as I'd like to happily embrace whatever I am and make the most of it, but alas it just isn't there), but God damn, I would have lots of sex with her. I'd probably even be down for giving her a blowjay.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by amerikangod

If a simple act of kindness is enough to turn a person around then they don't have hatred, they just have misguided anger that they've found a scapegoat for, which is two very different things.

"I give all but have not love, I gain nothing. Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
Love never fails."

Love is not simple kindness, is it a massive act of the heart, containing empathy, compassion and forgiveness in the face of all adversity.. It is powerful over all hindrance if it is sincere and unfeigned, above all you must give love always, and believe in love...

[amerikangod]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

"I give all but have not love, I gain nothing. Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
Love never fails."

Love is not simple kindness, is it a massive act of the heart, containing empathy, compassion and forgiveness in the face of all adversity.. It is powerful over all hindrance if it is sincere and unfeigned, above all you must give love always, and believe in love...

Whether you believe that love is something spiritual or purely biological and based in chemical reactions in the brain, I agree that it's a good thing and that we should make efforts to have it in our lives.

I do not believe it is all-powerful, not even close. "A massive act of the heart, containing empathy, compassion and forgiveness in the face of all adversity" might be able to correct some situations (even if it's complete overkill), but in many it'll leave you dead, broken or used, and in all of these, foolish.

You can't assume that such acts can appeal to everyone and everything, and especially can't expect the other party to even grasp the situation, especially if it's in the heat of the moment and you both have little time to react. That's assuming you even can perform such an act in the moment.