[pbradley]

 

[demonrail666]

From a British perspective, the whole Hilary/Obama thing is entirely mystifying. It's as though the Democrats want to make a point of internal principle rather than actually win an election. Obviously, being British, I have to take almost as much interest in the US election as I do my own. Given that sad fact, the prospect of the Democrats throwing away their chance in this way genuinely annoys me. They don't just have a responsibilty to their own party, but to their country and the world to take this far more seriously than they appear to be.

[pbradley]

I'll vote for whichever Democrat wins the primary as usual.

[tesla69]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

From a British perspective, the whole Hilary/Obama thing is entirely mystifying. It's as though the Democrats want to make a point of internal principle rather than actually win an election.

the Dems serve the same masters as the Rethugs - they are 2 different factions of the same right wing.

[MellySingsDoom]

My two cents: we (in the UK amyway), live in a corporate state, and all the main political parties exist now purely to serve these interests. I don't see it changing anytime soon - only a total meltdown of the economy would shake things up, and as seen in the Northern Rock episode here, the UK Government will do all it can to uphold corporate interests whilst dumping on it's subjects on a daily basis. Still, it's all marvellous, innit?

[demonrail666]

Remember when they used to have enquiries into that kind of thing? Heseltine and the Westlands fiasco? Now it's just shrugged off as 'economic responsibility'.

I'd like to say the way out is to endorse minority parties but looking at them they're just as bad, only without the corporate endorsement and seem only to serve crackpot fringe-groups instead.

BNP - White rascists
Respect - Muslim fundamentalists and Students that never read their manifesto.

Despite what i said about minority parties, I'll probably be voting Green again this election. And if they got into power they'll probably be just as big corporate whores, only this time they'll be turning tricks for Ben n Jerry's and the Wild Bean Cafe. Bet your life that Paul Mccartney will do their campaign song too!

[alyasa]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

Despite what i said about minority parties, I'll probably be voting Green again this election. And if they got into power they'll probably be just as big corporate whores, only this time they'll be turning tricks for Ben n Jerry's and the Wild Bean Cafe. Bet your life that Paul Mccartney will do their campaign song too!

It's about picking the lesser of two evils really... I doubt any of the proposed changes to the election and political system presented here might happen anytime in this millenium. For example, Singapore, where I live has had an electoral system that is free from rampant campaigning and institutes a closely-controlled system of funding, since its inception; nevertheless, for every election since the beginning, voters have only ever chosen one single party. Obviously, economic might is a very big issue with voters, and Bush et al have the werewithal to secure huge amounts of funds that, ultimately, is the only thing voters look for... In the end, I think it's better to change the mindset of the people than regulate the elected officials. So I say, vote Green if you have to...

[5Against1]

Originally Posted by alyasa

It's about picking the lesser of two evils really... I doubt any of the proposed changes to the election and political system presented here might happen anytime in this millenium. For example, Singapore, where I live has had an electoral system that is free from rampant campaigning and institutes a closely-controlled system of funding, since its inception; nevertheless, for every election since the beginning, voters have only ever chosen one single party. Obviously, economic might is a very big issue with voters, and Bush et al have the werewithal to secure huge amounts of funds that, ultimately, is the only thing voters look for... In the end, I think it's better to change the mindset of the people than regulate the elected officials. So I say, vote Green if you have to...

As a registered Green I can tell you that it's almost impossible to get on ballots, the Big Two have seen to this. Debates in which the Green candidate actually gets air time are hysterical, the others are simply befuddled by their own lack of knowledge as it relates to the issues. Bush and Kerry were like deer in the headlights last election when pitted against David Cobb (Green) and whomever the Libertarian guy was, it was eye opening and sad.

[alyasa]

That's ridiculous, I can never undrestand how politics has became a media circus in the states...

[5Against1]

Originally Posted by alyasa

That's ridiculous, I can never undrestand how politics has became a media circus in the states...

It's simple, not all states matter. I live in New York State, a Democrat is ALWAYS elected here...my vote means nothing really...other than I feel obligated to do it out of respect for those who died so I have the opportunity. If more poepole read the Green Platform they'd like it...it's just considerd "fringe".

[alyasa]

I seriously think that American politics needs a shake up before the whole world suffers for their sins...

[5Against1]

Originally Posted by alyasa

I seriously think that American politics needs a shake up before the whole world suffers for their sins...

It's that stupid electoral college, a mouth breather like Bush can lose a majority of the votes and still win. Americans love it though.

[5Against1]

Originally Posted by swa(y)

im just curious....not trying to be an asshole...but how many of those that died so you can have the opportnunity to vote wanted to die for that very reason?

how many people go into the military because they are patriotic and want to do something for their country?

how many join the amred forces because its literally about the easiest way into a decent career?

why are so many recruiting offices located in malls and shopping centers (id be willing to bet its because of all the looser kids that hang out...the 18 year olds fresh outta HS, not interested in going to college, and not a better damned thing to do)

how many go in cause they can do little else? maybe they were court ordered as an alrenative to jail...maybe they had a kid and needed a decent career....

i could be completely wrong, but im think only about ten percent of people that go in go in because they are "military mided". of course..what...atleast 75 percent of all that go in are forced into becoming "military minded" with all the mindless propaganda and all...

im just saying..i dont know...i just dont see why that would be a good reason to vote. i support voting, and think more people (including myself) should probally do it (even though i think it would be better if more people just decided to read up a bit and become not so...politcally ignorent).

i dont know man. i was just curious...seriously....as to why ya feel that way.

how many were drafted into vietnam agaist their will?

After Pearl Harbor lines formed around the block at recruitment centers, these men died so I can vote. The outcome of WWII was never a "slam dunk" and we (The UK included) could have easily lost. Watch the first 20 minutes of Saving Private Ryan and then give me a good reason to NOT spend a few minutes voting. Vietnam, Korea, and this Iraqi mess are not to be confused with the ACTUAL THREAT of WWII. Nobody recruited those men in WWII, they responded.

[tesla69]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Contacts:
Jack Aponte (jack @ srlp.org, 347-247-1526)
Naomi Clark (naomi @ srlp.org, 917-907-4870)

Police Brutality Strikes Fifth Anniversary of Sylvia Rivera Law Project


NEW YORK - On the night of Wednesday, September 26, officers from the
9th Precinct of the New York Police Department attacked without
provocation members of the Sylvia Rivera Law Project and of its
community. Two of our community members were violently arrested, and

others were pepper sprayed in the face without warning or cause.

The Sylvia Rivera Law Project (www.srlp.org) is an organization that
works on behalf of low-income people of color who are transgender,

gender non-conforming, or intersex, providing free legal services and
advocacy among many other initiatives. On Wednesday night, the Sylvia
Rivera Law Project was celebrating its fifth anniversary with a
celebration and fundraising event at a bar in the East Village.


A group of our community members, consisting largely of queer and
transgender people of color, witnessed two officers attempting to
detain a young Black man outside of the bar. Several of our community
members asked the officers why they were making the arrest and using

excessive force. Despite the fact that our community was on the
sidewalk, gathered peacefully and not obstructing foot traffic, the
NYPD chose to forcefully grab two people and arrested them. Without
warning, an officer then sprayed pepper spray across the group in a

wide arc, temporarily blinding many and causing vomiting and intense
pain.

"This is the sort of all-too-common police violence and overreaction
towards people of color that happens all the time," said Dean Spade,

founder of the Sylvia Rivera Law Project. "It's ironic that we were
celebrating the work of an organization that specifically opposes
state violence against marginalized communities, and we experienced a

police attack at our celebration."

"We are outraged, and demand that our community members be released
and the police be held accountable for unnecessary use of excessive
force and falsely arresting people," Spade continued.


Damaris Reyes is executive director of GOLES, an organization working
to preserve the Lower East Side. She commented, "I'm extremely
concerned and disappointed by the 9th Precinct's response to the

situation and how it escalated into violence. This kind of aggressive
behavior doesn't do them any good in community-police relations."

Supporters will be gathering at 100 Centre Street tomorrow, where the

two community members will be arraigned. The community calls for
charges to be dropped and to demand the immediate release of those
arrested.

*******
The Audre Lorde Project
Center for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Two Spirit & Transgender

[ThePits]

I am always amazed how many times police, for no apparent reason, beat the crap out of innocent people.
You would think with the amount of times it allegedly happens some bugger would have captured pictures on their mobile phone or even a bit of video footage.
Whilst I appreciate that not all police are innocent and some certainly do go over the top and deserve to be jailed, I just find, in an age where everyone from the age of 12 upwards seems to have a mobile phone with a camera on it, that there is this distinct lack of independant incontrovertible evidence

[tesla69]

I haven't been called any names yet today by atari! Maybe he took his meds for a change...maybe the Feds aren't sending him his paycheck...

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crim...html?p rint=1
Science teacher's brush with police ends in heart attack
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BY JOHN MARZULLI
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
Monday, October 8th 2007, 4:00 AM

Lester Jacob says he was nearly scared to death by NYPD cops who mistook him for a perp.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A mild-mannered Brooklyn high school teacher says he was nearly scared to death by NYPD cops who mistook him for a perp.
When the violent encounter was over, Lester Jacob, 50, suffered a heart attack and was left on his own in the street by cops, who accused him of "acting."
In July he underwent open-heart surgery.
Jacob had the misfortune to be driving home through Brownsville, Brooklyn, on June 22 around the same time cops were on the lookout for a hit-and-run driver. Jacob, an earth science teacher at James Madison High School in Midwood, heard a siren, looked in his rear-view mirror and dutifully pulled over for the radio car behind him.
He wasn't prepared for what happened next. Two officers rushed up to Jacob's vehicle and pointed their guns at his head, according to a lawsuit filed in Brooklyn Federal Court.
Cursing at him, they ordered Jacobs out of the car and roughly cuffed him.
"One officer crushed his knee into Mr. Jacob's back," the complaint states. "They then repeatedly slammed his head onto the car and then pressed his head against the car for some time."
Additional officers arrived on the scene with a witness to the earlier accident. The witness told them Jacob was the wrong guy.
"'I told you it was a white Maxima,'" the witness reportedly said, according to the complaint. Jacob drives a white Infiniti.
Jacob told the cops he was experiencing chest pains and began coughing uncontrollably.
A female cop said, "Nice acting," according to Jacob, and then drove off. Jacob said he struggled to drive home, stopping to vomit on the side of the road.
His wife rushed him to the hospital, where doctors determined he had suffered a heart attack.
"I was scared to death," Jacob said of his brush with the NYPD. "I was feeling terror."
His attorney John Lambros said there was no reason for the cops to handcuff or use excessive force against the 150-pound teacher while they were waiting for the witness to show up.
The cops were not identified, but their radio car number has been turned over to the Civilian Complaint Review Board. A spokeswoman for the city Law Department said the complaint is being reviewed.

[atari 2600]

Originally Posted by tesla69

I haven't been called any names yet today by atari! Maybe he took his meds for a change...maybe the Feds aren't sending him his paycheck...

You're a paranoid fucking dumbass.

Happy now, freak?

[5Against1]

Originally Posted by swa(y)

the same thing happened after the WTC situation. yep. and im firmly convinced yr average soldier is just as confused as to what is actually going on as every one else is...IF, he even cares at all.

i cant help but to feel sorry for all the soldiers that were killed by native americans....so that we could one day have the right to vote in their land.

You've strayed from the original thought just a tad. The plight of the Native Americans isn't the topic, you're mixing apples and oranges.

[demonrail666]

We don't live in a 'police state' or 'fascist state', we live in a state of domestic neglect. So long as Downing Street and The White House continues on its global odyssey applying band-aids to the world's problems, we should be demanding that our governments take a long hard look at the mess on their own doorstep.

[tesla69]

Originally Posted by atari 2600

[/size][/size]
You're a paranoid fucking dumbass.

Happy now, freak?

At least I'm a man.

http://www.plentyoffish.com/member820994.htm