[stu666]

 

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

 

7/10

That's one of my fave Fulcis. Although I love the full-on excess of Zombie Flesheaters (as it's known in the UK) I increasingly prefer his more restrained (by his standards) gothic stuff like House by the Cemetery, City of the Living Dead and (his best film for me) The Beyond. I love it when Fulci gets all gloomy.

[demonrail666]

Yeah, 'disquieting' is a good way of describing it. And you're right, the spider scene is from The Beyond. I suppose Fulci's reputation is built on those kinds of outre set-pieces but in retrospect I think they often cheapened a lot of his movies - I love The Beyond but have to admit some of the set-pieces, like the one including the spiders, while a lot of fun, is ultimately a bit silly, really. The only film that they really work in for me is Zombie Flesheaters, which never takes itself too seriously from the beginning.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

http://s3.amazonaws.com/criterion-pr...jpg?1328128325

Ok, I think this is my favorite movie of all time. This goes back to what I was saying a few pages ago about the importance of silence and how it's often underappreciated. The opening scene is my favorite scene ever shot. What it did for me is most likely different from Fellini's intentions, I'm not sure. I got the feeling of being surrounded by the impersonal side of people and the pressures of dealing with them. They poke away at you persistently as you try to escape those pressures... as he is evidently trying to escape from something... which culminates in the iconic scene where the guy on the shore pulls the rope as Mastroianni goes flying down towards the ocean. The entire experience of this film is like a dream, and I'm most captivated by this quality in others like La Dolce Vita (my second favorite of his). It's a movie that remains fresh every time you watch it. There is a lot to take in, and it's always a treat to go into it and notice or look at something in a new way.

10/10, a rare one. Perfect.

unfortunately i must spread more butter, etc. but FUCK YES. on eveyr count.

my favorite moment is when he hides under the table like a little kid.

though maybe i like la dolce vita a little more. or no... asa nisi masa!

[fugazifan]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

 

Ok, I think this is my favorite movie of all time. This goes back to what I was saying a few pages ago about the importance of silence and how it's often underappreciated. The opening scene is my favorite scene ever shot. What it did for me is most likely different from Fellini's intentions, I'm not sure. I got the feeling of being surrounded by the impersonal side of people and the pressures of dealing with them. They poke away at you persistently as you try to escape those pressures... as he is evidently trying to escape from something... which culminates in the iconic scene where the guy on the shore pulls the rope as Mastroianni goes flying down towards the ocean. The entire experience of this film is like a dream, and I'm most captivated by this quality in others like La Dolce Vita (my second favorite of his). It's a movie that remains fresh every time you watch it. There is a lot to take in, and it's always a treat to go into it and notice or look at something in a new way.

10/10, a rare one. Perfect.

i agree with everything you said, its my favorite movie as well. it is also really funny, something that isnt discussed as much. and for me, my favorite is the last scene (and all of the others) i am a big fan of dance and carnival. the last scene of this movie is basically my favorite "thing" ever, as in favorite film scene favorite music favorite imaginary. just perfect.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

 

"
I've never understood why so many people hate this movie. The jokes are funny, Howard is convincing, the cast is wonderful (Lea Thompson, Jeffrey Jones, and Tim Robbins), the crude 80's CGI is great, and the stop-motion animation towards the end is even more impressive.

Every time I watch this movie, I enjoy it. No matter how old I am. This has the same amount of charm as the first Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle movie, except with a raunchier sense of humor.

9/10

 

My first time seeing it in full. I'm intrigued by Lucas' non-Star Wars related efforts and I've gotta say - I like what I see very much so.

Lucas paints a wonderfully fun portrayal of his beloved decade, and even manages to get great performances out of his cast, which is almost shocking to anyone who has seen any of the more recent Star Wars films (I can't stand Hayden Christensen in anything he's in). In fact, this really reminded me of a Linklater film - except way before Richard's time in the industry. Anyone else feel that? It just feels so free-flowing, without any real central star at all.

I was confused by the ending. Where a few main characters pictures showed up and there was a brief description of what happens to each after the events of the film. Is this based on Lucas' friends and him? I don't quite understand.

Anywho, I'm watching THX 1138 tonight. It looks trippier than hell. I wish Lucas would break through his Star Wars nutshell and make something fresh and original again. His heart obviously isn't anywhere near that franchise anymore.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

Originally Posted by stu666

 

How is this?

I've always found Svankmajer's stuff to be really rad.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

 

Ok, I think this is my favorite movie of all time.

10/10, a rare one. Perfect.

I've only seen 2 Fellini films. I really liked 8 1/2, and loathed La Dolce Vita. LDV left such a bad taste in my mouth.

Amarcord looks very visually stimulating and queer, I think I'd like that one a lot. Satyricon seems it would bore me.

ha

Originally Posted by Murmer99

 

7/10

That's a pretty fair assessment. I'd probably score it with an 8.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

What exactly is so good about La Dolce Vita? I've never understood it. I hear it praised all the time.

EDIT: serious question

[Torn Curtain]

 

7/10
The film is a bit awkward at times, I think it gets better in the second half when things get darker.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

I guess it isn't possible to tell you why the film is "so good" and expect you to agree with it. It's a subjective enjoyment I got out of the experience. I was moved by Fellini's symbolism.... and the opening scene of the helicopter carrying the statue around with no music also did something for me. The fountain scene is another I'll always cherish... scenes I would call "iconic". But like I said, I've never believed (perhaps with at least a modicum of exceptions) in describing to people why a piece of work is good or bad, as it's obvious you either like it or you don't.

There's no actual plot... and it feels like it's about to get messy and come off as "aimless". But the message is simple, the characters and their materialistic ways make their lives seem glorious on the surface, but their true nature is that of anguish. It has the cynicism of many of his works but combines enough humor and I suppose hope as well. Mastroianni's character and the act where he encounters his father as they go to the cha cha club is another moment I enjoyed very much. There's always this feeling of being in a dream when I watch something by Fellini and sometimes it's even difficult to put my finger on why it is in particular scenes. There's an honesty I admire and I feel like most of his releases, if not all, emanated from a great deal of inspiration. He's one of my favorites and always will be. The film follows an entire week into the world of the protagonist and I guess I really like that world.

How many times have you seen it?

Only once, and honestly I didn't even bother finishing it. Which is a crime, I know. I definitely at least got 3/4 of the way through though.

I don't think the symbolism really spoke to me at all, and I never really picked up on the dreaminess of it, like with 8 1/2. But I can see where you're coming from. The fountain scene and that statue do stick out in my mind, but I cna't remember much anything else.

Funny how what you took as dreamlike and beautiful, I took as boring events in a fancy pair of high heels. Like literally, that is odd to me. ha I'd like to think I can agree with you more times than not. I do appreciate hearing what you liked about it though. Maybe I'll try and go into it with new eyes. I am a bit older than when I previously watched it.

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by Dr. Eugene Felikson

 

My first time seeing it in full. I'm intrigued by Lucas' non-Star Wars related efforts and I've gotta say - I like what I see very much so.

I was confused by the ending. Where a few main characters pictures showed up and there was a brief description of what happens to each after the events of the film. Is this based on Lucas' friends and him? I don't quite understand.

I don't think there's anything particularly personal behind the ending, besides Lucas likely having had schoolfriends who graduated and then went straight off to Vietnam. In that sense I took it as one of those 'end of innocence' stories, and was maybe the key film in ushering in a kind of teen nostalgia (people like Corman had always focused on contemporary youth cults). It seemed to solidify a kind of cult-of-innocence around that whole early RnR era, that obviously inspired later films like Grease, Peggy Sue Got Married, Porky's and the first Back to the Future or TV shows like Happy Days and The Wonder Years.

It also gets a lot of credit for its innovative approach to soundtracks, using nothing but pre-recorded pop music. That was apparently a big influence on Scorsese (although Scorsese argues it was Kenneth Anger's Scorpio Rising), as well as the way scenes were kind of synchronised to the music, without the film being a bona fide musical. (Again, Scorpio Rising did it first but more people obviously saw American Graffiti.)

I think AG is a massive film on so many levels: ushering in an entire 50s nostalgia industry that still remains; translating previously 'underground' ideas into viable mainstream ones; etc.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Dr. Eugene Felikson

What exactly is so good about La Dolce Vita? I've never understood it. I hear it praised all the time.

EDIT: serious question

hm let's see the first time i saw it i came home drunk at 3am and it was on tv and i was like "what the fuck is this???" it was the part with the dad and the dancers in the sad cabaret and what happens after.

anyway eventually i saw it in full, i've seen it a bunch of times, i saw it when it was bought and restored by scorsese & it was shown in all its glory at the national gallery of art. it was fucking gorgeous.

anyway, about the movie

first, if you have eyes you'll have to agree at least that the cinematography is delicious. the editing is also perfect enough to be invisible. so thats takes care of that.

now for the story which is what i supposed bored you.

***SPOILER ALERT***

la dolce vita tells a pretty straighforward linear story, which is that of the successive degradation of a sellout who throws away the chance of being an artist in order to chase money and meaningless relationships. he goes from promising writer to journalist to pr sellout.

this happens in a kind of progressive spiritual void-- the church isn't there, philosophy isn't there (his philosopher friend kills himself), his father isn't there, he can find no love, the old nobility is a bunch of inbred degenerates, divorces get celebrated with parties, and when he has a chance to hear again his muse (the little girl at the beach) he quickly abandons her for the noise & racket of "the world". which is why at the end she reappears, remember? and he can't hear her anymore, he walks away with his party friends, and there's a chasm (literally, some sort of formation on the sand) between them. this all works on the images--no subtitles necessary really.

f you look at parallels, claudia cardinale in 81/2 is the same muse figure, the woman who inspires him to make art rather than fuck (his mistress) or feel terrible about himself (his wife). this is almost classic plato. 81/2 is in many ways the same story as la dolce vita, except that this character chose art and is able to find some sort of salvation or escape. by the way, woody allen almost literally ripped that off for deconstructing harry.

now this tale of degeneration is all a pretty clear and obvious narrative and not revolutionary in any sense, you could go back to balzac's "lost illusions" for its sources, or even further, you could look at picaresque literature and find the same themes of progressive corruption of its hero--even going back to the satyricon. still, the way he does it is wonderful and 50+ years after he made it still relevant to our media-centric time of tmz and perez hilton.

give it another shot if you can or maybe watch it with the commentary on.

but anyway, hm, the problem i think you have relating is that the world where marcello ends is the world where you begin-- the world of kim kardashian and jerry springer and nihilism. fellini saw this era coming on and his vision turned out pretty prophetic, but looking back with no reference to a world that had meaning you might not get a sense of anything lost and therefore not see the tragedy.

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by Dr. Eugene Felikson

What exactly is so good about La Dolce Vita? I've never understood it. I hear it praised all the time.

EDIT: serious question

Don't worry about it. Have you seen Chris Morris' Nathan Barley? There's a scene in it where the hero, a journalist for a style mag, finally sees this empty self congratulating hipster world that he's a part of, for what it is. He then announces that 'the idiots are winning' and has a kind of nervous breakdown. You think he's gonna rebel against it all but he ultimately just joins them. That's pretty much La Dolce Vita's message.

And in a way, that's why La Dolce Vita, more than almost any other art movie I can think of, has endured so well. Marcello Mastroianni's character remains a kind of contemporary archetype: relateable to anyone who's ever found themselves in a scene they think is drowning their true potential but who lacks the drive or sense of purpose to move beyond it. It's two and a half hours of someone on SYG announcing that this place is a waste of time and that they're leaving, only to come back a week later feeling a little bit disgusted with themselves. Read el symbols response again and apply it to this place. Almost uncanny. But where's the girl on the beach?

 

[fugazifan]

Originally Posted by Dr. Eugene Felikson

How is this?

I've always found Svankmajer's stuff to be really rad.

i really enjoyed little otik. i have seen a few of his shorts as well as alice. this is definitely a bizarre film, but also much more "normal than the other things of his that i have seen. i really like the fairy tale quality to it. i would definitely see it again.

[evollove]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

la dolce vita tells a pretty straighforward linear story

The word "basic," I believe, was also used. "Simple," maybe.

Then why is it so fucking long? And why does 8 1/2 feel just as long? Do films about self-indulgent people need to be so damned self-indulgent?

I Vitelloni and Nights of Cabiria are my two favs. I'm sure they bore a lot of viewers, but La Dolce Vita bores me, so there you go. And the last time I watched 8 1/2, I fast-forwarded to the bordello scene (which is still mighty impressive) and skipped the rest.

But then, Bergman is my favorite director. I'm sure his stuff bores most people to tears, but I find damn near every frame a thrill. To each their own.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by evollove

The word "basic," I believe, was also used. "Simple," maybe.

???

i'm sure synonyms happen.

Originally Posted by evollove

Then why is it so fucking long?

I'd ask Fellini, but he's dead.

But if you ask me why it goes over and meanders so much, i'd say it's because it's concerned not so much with its hero but also the world around him. so each "episode" covers something different-- religion, the cult of celebrity, the failure of philosophy, the failure of the family, etc. it's a big complicated world and fellini dared to take on the challenge of surveying it.

Originally Posted by evollove

And why does 8 1/2 feel just as long?

I suppose it's cuz you don't like it? Just a guess. Einstein had some ideas about this.

Originally Posted by evollove

Do films about self-indulgent people need to be so damned self-indulgent?

you don't have to like these movies, but "self-indulgent"? you mean it's wrong of a director to pursue teh themes they like? i don't understand the accusation. it's art, you know? "self-indulgent" by definition.

also: ranting on the internet about movies instead of saving hungry children? self-indulgent.

but to accuse la dolce vita of being self-indulgent just because it's long is an error in judgment. the movie is about all sorts of things going on in society and the world, it's almost a documentary, it's concerned with the things that surround us, so no, it's not so much about "self" or little personal obsessions, which is why it endures so well.

Originally Posted by evollove

I Vitelloni and Nights of Cabiria are my two favs.

great stuff

Originally Posted by evollove

I'm sure they bore a lot of viewers,

i'm sure. it's impossible for everyone to please everyone else all the time.

Originally Posted by evollove

but La Dolce Vita bores me, so there you go.

wait, what do i have to do with your boredom? and why does this matter?

Originally Posted by evollove

And the last time I watched 8 1/2, I fast-forwarded to the bordello scene (which is still mighty impressive) and skipped the rest.

and this is relevant because...?

Originally Posted by evollove

But then, Bergman is my favorite director.

congrats are in order?

Originally Posted by evollove

I'm sure his stuff bores most people to tears, but I find damn near every frame a thrill.

yes, but what does this have to do with la dolce vita or why that movie is great, regardless of your own personal tastes? something can be great and boring at the same time. farming, for example. or the fucking illiad and its unending catalogs.

Originally Posted by evollove

To each their own.

of course. but so?

felikson asked a serious question so i gave him a serious answer. my post above wasn't written for you, but if you feel otherwise i can assure you those feelings are misguided.

anyway, you still could refute what i'm telling him and argue that la dolce vita is not great, or not that important, but doing so with the sole argument that it bores you personally is way more self-indulgent than la dolce vita itself could ever be. yes? yes.

 

[evollove]

This is too easy.

EDIT: Ok. Fine. I'll take you seriously.

I, like you, was expressing an opinion. That's it. Why take it so personal? My gripe was with Fel, not you. Geez. Chill out. Anyway, none of this stuff matters in the least.

And I'm sure Dr. F appreciated your response. It was well thought out. I doubt he understood it, but that's his fault and another matter entirely.

Hug?

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by evollove

This is too easy.

EDIT: Ok. Fine. I'll take you seriously.

I, like you, was expressing an opinion. That's it. Why take it so personal? My gripe was with Fel, not you. Geez. Chill out. Anyway, none of this stuff matters in the least.

And I'm sure Dr. F appreciated your response. It was well thought out. I doubt he understood it, but that's his fault and another matter entirely.

Hug?

lolol okay sure, but no assgrab.

i though you had taken offense at my commentary or something. i didn't get that you were arguing him felixon via my post. anyway, shit happens, sorry for the misunderstanding.

i'll have to take issue with "i doubt he understood it" though. i like felixon, which is why i took time to write him an explain, and i don't want to get in the middle of your fight if you're having one.

but yeah, peace and love and all that shit, of course. i've said this here before but i don't care so much about agreements/disagreements as i care about people who give enough of a shit about movies to take time to discuss them.

[evollove]

Cool, etc.

This is interesting. My issue with Dr. F--who may very well be a nice fellow in "real life"--is that he wants to be a filmmaker, and his biggest influences are Buffy and comic books. The world doesn't need yet another "filmmaker" like that.

Huh. I guess that means I care too.