[knox]

interesting story and not to be an asshole or anything i dont see how that story has anything to do with statistics?

[wellcharge]

"but you will see female ones doing a whole shitload of work that goes way beyond the definition of the job and so on."

you're saying women do a shitload of work that goes way beyond the definition of the job and so on.

and i haven't seen it

[knox]

Originally Posted by wellcharge

"but you will see female ones doing a whole shitload of work that goes way beyond the definition of the job and so on."

you're saying women do a shitload of work that goes way beyond the definition of the job and so on.

and i haven't seen it

i am basically saying in general there are jobs that women usually get, usually associated with women: working in shops, receptions, maids, nannies, etc.

in my experience in the corporate world, what ive seen is women being mainly restricted to minor admin jobs and having to work twice as hard as men in order to gain any sort of promotion, and also being fired a lot more easily.

which statistics can support.

[Dead-Air]

why, oh why, did I start this stupid thread?

I blame liquid marijuana, but it's still no excuse for triggering the war of the sexes.

I apologize to everybody, especially all of the women I've undoubtedly shown disrespect for/to. please come punish me for my sins (yours too if you'd like) at your leisure.

[demonrail666]

When I was doing my degree I worked for an office removals company. Some of the people I worked with were women and what I found was that a lot of the men, out of some kind of male pride, would insist that they did the heavier work. I'd also notice that a lot of them would try and lift heavier things on their own if a woman was around to watch, than if they were just around men. They'd then slate these same women off behind their back for not pulling their weight. I'm not saying that reflects what goes on elsewhere but I saw it a lot.

[knox]

im enjoying the thread dead-air, it has developed into an interesting dicussion, so apologies are not required.

[wellcharge]

Originally Posted by knox

i am basically saying in general there are jobs that women usually get, usually associated with women: working in shops, receptions, maids, nannies, etc.

in my experience in the corporate world, what ive seen is women being mainly restricted to minor admin jobs and having to work twice as hard as men in order to gain any sort of promotion, and also being fired a lot more easily.

which statistics can support.

i believe you, i'm curious as to why you think that happens ? surely there must be restrictions against it so how come it happens? do you think it's because the administration thinks men are more capable or what? i can't see a reason so there's probably some bullshit going on

[knox]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

When I was doing my degree I worked doing office removals. Some of the people I worked with were women and what I found was that a lot of the men, out of some kind of male pride would insist that they did the heavier work. I'd also notice that a lot of the men would try and lift heavier things on their own if a woman was around to see them than if they were just around men. They'd then slate these same women off behind their back for not pulling their weight. I'm not saying that reflects what goes on elsewhere but I saw it a lot.

it reflects what we think deep down.
i never implied that women don't contribute to sexist behaviour, they do.

however, when we say "equality" we must think of biological differences as well. You can't just decide - for example - that in the name of "equality" women can't take maternity leave.

[knox]

Originally Posted by wellcharge

i believe you, i'm curious as to why you think that happens ? surely there must be restrictions against it so how come it happens? do you think it's because the administration thinks men are more capable or what? i can't see a reason so there's probably some bullshit going on

1- administration ARE men.
2- culture.
3- women are capable of getting pregnant, therefore, requiring maternity leave and becoming mothers, which administration thinks makes them focus in work less.
4- the general idea that women are less intelligent, focused and ambitious.
5- the general idea (in higher positions) that women are more moral and have more empathy, which sometimes clashes with the decisions required by these jobs. they think they lack agression.
6- men feel threatened and awkward having to treat them as equals instead of bossing them around.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Dead-Air

why, oh why, did I start this stupid thread?

I blame liquid marijuana, but it's still no excuse for triggering the war of the sexes.

I apologize to everybody, especially all of the women I've undoubtedly shown disrespect for/to. please come punish me for my sins (yours too if you'd like) at your leisure.

thread was fine, some people here may not know your ex was a stripper, not understand your context, and people are quick to make moral condemnations on the interwebs, and political correctness is often a mask for puritanism.

i say congratulations on starting such a prolific thread, though the reading gets a bit heavy at times-- not heavy as in "difficult" but heavy as in "oh noes, i've read/heard this same tirade 1,000,000,000,000,000 times before". not to say there's not any truth in either side of the debate, it's just-- eh, let the kids sort it out for themselves, no harm in passionate discussion, even if passion is not sufficient for good discussion. have a beer & join in.

if on the other hand this is a ploy to get some girl to come & spank you i hope it works, you kinky bastard! have fun.

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by knox

it reflects what we think deep down.
i never implied that women don't contribute to sexist behaviour, they do.

however, when we say "equality" we must think of biological differences as well. You can't just decide - for example - that in the name of "equality" women can't take maternity leave.

No, you missed my point. The women were accused of being lazy but what was happening was the guys were just showing off in front of them. I knew the man who ran the company and he said it was a tactic that was commonplace: that men work far harder in manual labour when they're around women, rather than women doing less. It's a male vanity thing. Some of the women I worked with were far stronger than a lot of the men, they were just sensible enough to let them get on with breaking their backs.

[wellcharge]

Originally Posted by knox

1- administration ARE men.
2- culture.
3- women are capable of getting pregnant, therefore, requiring maternity leave and becoming mothers, which administration thinks makes them focus in work less.

as far as administration being men that would be easy to change with some promotions, maternity leave makes sense but it's still weird they would rather promote other men. i guess in business they value people who have no life out of the company and getting pregnant would make it impossible for people to that

Top 10 Rich List

1 Warren Buffett

2 Carlos Slim Helu

3 Bill Gates

4 Lakshmi Mittal

5 Mukesh Ambani


6 Anil Ambani

7 Ingvar Kamprad

8 KP Singh

9 Oleg Deripaska

10 Karl Albrecht


all male

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

When I was doing my degree I worked for an office removals company. Some of the people I worked with were women and what I found was that a lot of the men, out of some kind of male pride, would insist that they did the heavier work. I'd also notice that a lot of them would try and lift heavier things on their own if a woman was around to watch, than if they were just around men. They'd then slate these same women off behind their back for not pulling their weight. I'm not saying that reflects what goes on elsewhere but I saw it a lot.

what a bunch of douchebags. of course if you're around a pretty girl you'll offer to carry the big load and impress her with your guns (that's what here in 'merica we call biceps). chivalry and male display are instinctual behaviors-- don't tell me you don't stand up straight from your usual paunch-forward slouch the moment an attractive woman walks into the room. oh yeah, inflate that chest. biology!

but TO BITCH ABOUT IT is a complete load of ass. i pity the low-testosterone fools. j'accuse! or something.

[knox]

Originally Posted by demonrail666

No, you missed my point. The women were accused of being lazy but what was happening was the guys were just showing off in front of them. I knew the man who ran the company and he said it was a tactic that was commonplace: that men work far harder in manual labour when they're around women, rather than women doing less. It's a male vanity thing. Some of the women I worked with were far stronger than a lot of the men, they were just sensible enough to let them get on with breaking their backs.

yes thats why i said culture plays a major role.
men like to feel "manly" around women, and women like to feel "protected" by men.

[Dead-Air]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

if on the other hand this is a ploy to get some girl to come & spank you i hope it works, you kinky bastard! have fun.

who me? cry and act self pitious in order to get women to hurt me more? c'mon I didn't even offer to tip this time. though I'm always negotiable, of course.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by knox

yes thats why i said culture plays a major role.
men like to feel "manly" around women, and women like to feel "protected" by men.

culture or genes? humanities types tend to dismiss the fact that our brains are hardwired to do a lot of stuff.

i'm not saying this applies to 100% of the population or if you don't you're a sick deviant-- i'm saying that the species has developed behaviors for millions of years and reading books won't so readily change that.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Dead-Air

who me? cry and act self pitious in order to get women to hurt me more? c'mon I didn't even offer to tip this time. though I'm always negotiable, of course.

ha ha, well, you know there are always the nurse types! they like that stuff.

gotta run but feel no guilt from your thread man. it's all good.

[knox]

Originally Posted by wellcharge

as far as administration being men that would be easy to change with some promotions, maternity leave makes sense but it's still weird they would rather promote other men. i guess in business they value people who have no life out of the company and getting pregnant would make it impossible for people to that

Top 10 Rich List

1 Warren Buffett

2 Carlos Slim Helu

3 Bill Gates

4 Lakshmi Mittal

5 Mukesh Ambani


6 Anil Ambani

7 Ingvar Kamprad

8 KP Singh

9 Oleg Deripaska

10 Karl Albrecht


all male

I guess, in the end, the biggest reason is that men feel threatened by women. I recently read that the women with the most education, money and power are the ones that can't get married, they claim men can't deal with being with women that they see as "superior", they want to feel "needed".

I also think that society in general fears changing the order of things, sort of like "what would women do if they had more power?", we don't know what the world would be like, so it is a scary change.

[wellcharge]

Originally Posted by knox

4- the general idea that women are less intelligent, focused and ambitious.
5- the general idea (in higher positions) that women are more moral and have more empathy, which sometimes clashes with the decisions required by these jobs. they think they lack agression.
6- men feel threatened and awkward having to treat them as equals instead of bossing them around.

i just have seen your edits.

4. when i was in school the female students always got the best grades and were in the most clubs,favored by the teachers etc. i've never actually heard someone say any of that, maybe they think it secretly, it never crossed my mind that women aren't smart,but i'm not smart so i wouldn't notice even if it were true
5.maybe in higher positions that's the attitude,i don't know, but i think most men are well aware that women are capable of pure and absolute evil
6.yeah probably

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by knox

yes thats why i said culture plays a major role.
men like to feel "manly" around women, and women like to feel "protected" by men.

Yeah, that's obviously true, although in this instance I don't think the women wanted or liked to feel protected by the men, they were just sensible enough to play along with their game. Some of them wouldn't, and even tried to out muscle these men, which just led to this quite funny escalation of two sides trying to lift more chairs than the next.

Needless to say I'd spend the entire day moving table lamps from one office to the other and sneaking out for cigarettes with all the other sensible ones.

Male pride is one thing, but I've yet to meet a woman who's seduced by a guy doubled up from a slipped disc.