Hi Americans

With this whole hooha about this poor kid being shot for the crime of being in posession of a hoodie, some skittles and ebonics, im kinda reminded of why your gun laws are colossally, batshit insane.

Yours sincerely
Dismayed majority of the developed world

A Russian banker's in a coma after getting shot in London. Despite the UK's draconian gun laws, people are still getting shot here.

are you trolling or making a serious point?

Anyway, the guy in the trayvon martin case hasnt even been arrested, at least the police are investigating the guy from the story you mentioned. Also, kids involved in shooting that poor bangladeshi girl are about to get sent down.

So thats two high profile British cases, in which neither involved a legal firearm. And we have one killing in the US, and the only reason its getting international attention is the fact it appears to be racial in nature. We never hear about the ones that happen for other reasons, but they happen, and they involve legal firearms.

This.

Only idiots think it's possible to live in a world without firearms. Laws regarding them matter little...they aren't going anywhere.

Super easy to get. Easy and cheap and they exist all over the place legally or illegally.

Gun laws are about as useful as drug laws. How many people do you know that smoke pot? How many people do you know that own a gun? How many people keep it private? A shitload. Most people that own guns are responsible with them. Argument over.

how does it have nothing to do with racism?

i think that while some of that may be true there is still deep rooted institutionalized racism in the US that goes beyond day to day interactions. one example of that is the prison industrial complex and the way in which people of color are much more likely to be incarcerated regardless of crime rates.

and i think that its true that people get killed everyday but there seems to be a reason why this boy was killed and had he been white it seems much less likely that he would have been killed for that reason.

this is from eve goldberg and linda evans work on the prison industrial complex http://globalresearch.ca/articles/EVA110A.html:
"Here at home, the war on drugs has been a war on poor people. Particularly poor, urban, African-American men and women. It's well documented that police enforcement of the new, harsh drug laws have been focused on low- level dealers in communities of color. Arrests of African-Americans have been about five times higher than arrests of whites, although whites and African- Americans use drugs at about the same rate. And, African-Americans have been imprisoned in numbers even more disproportionate than their relative arrest rates. It is estimated that in 1994, on any given day, one out of every 128 U.S. adults was incarcerated, while one out of every 17 African-American adult males was incarcerated. "

Arrests of African-Americans have been about five times higher than arrests of whites, although whites and African- Americans use drugs at about the same rate.

they didn't say that they use drugs in the same numbers but rather in the same rates. that means that although lets say both communities have a lets say 10% drug use, there will be a higher rate of blacks incarcerated for the same crime. the black community and many communities of color have problems in the us, as well as in canada. but i think that it is wrong to write it off as just problems that have nothing to do with race, and to not look at how these problems came about.

Its a nice ideal to not want skin colour to matter, but in a practical situation, say when a paranoid guy with a gun sees a black kid wearing a hoodie, or when a business wants to hire someone to an important presentational position, suddenly all those ideals go out the window, people panic and resort to their most primitive responses.

We operate on very low levels a lot of the time, we're not all high-minded, we're still very unevolved. It takes recognition of our base nature to discover why we should always strive to be better than it.

"We bear the stamp of our lowly origins" as Darwin said. And the killer certainly displayed his.

this past november Kenneth Chamberlain, Sr, a black man, was murdered in his home by the police who were there to help him with a medical situation.
http://www.democracynow.org/2012/3/2...hite_plains_ny

another one today.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17590859

remember kids, guns don't kill people, people kill people. With Guns.

People kill people with all sorts of shit. Blaming guns for killing is like blaming drugs for the addict....ie, people take drugs, drugs don't take people.

The majority shouldn't suffer because of a few bad apples. Maybe we should ban cars because of all the stupid car related deaths?

My main concern with guns is that there are no second thoughts. If you get "enraged" and start beating someone up it can took quite a while to KILL, you could even change your mind or be stopped before you actually murder someone. With a gun, you pull the trigger and it's done, the other guy coul be dead in a second, and no one would be able to stop you in time nor save him.



Really stupid comparison between cars and guns.
Cars are not built to kill people, they have another purpose, in case you didn't notice. Lots of things can kill by accident (especially when used by stupid people). But guns are built for killing people. Period. Unless you live like Homer in that simpsons episode.

No one can really stop a drunk driver for passing out at the wheel on the interstate during rush hour resulting in numerous fatal accidents. Also, guns aren't intended to kill people, either. Of course they can kill people, but so can explosives which are far easier for some kid to build in his garage. Guns, in most cases, are used as a deterrent (as I've said countless times, most that might be considering a crime against one with a gun are more likely to reconsider whatever crime. If one doesn't own a gun, less likely to reconsider crime). NOT considering war, I bet guns (not fired) have stopped more crimes from occurring than actual incidents to where triggers have been pulled.

And dude...cars seriously do not always kill by accident. The things are basically large drivable bullets and have been used as such. maybe not as much as guns, but it's happened. Where do you draw the line?

And, how would stricter gun laws change anything? Do you feel strict drug laws make a serious difference? Where there is a demand, there will always be a supply. Guns have been around a long time, homie. I doubt they are going anywhere anytime soon...but still, feel free to dream away.

Guns, in most cases, are used for self protection. A VERY small percentage of folks that own a gun ever actually pull the trigger while pointing it at someone else. MOST PEOPLE DO NOT WANT TO KILL OTHER PEOPLE, period.

Uhh....I'm pretty sure guns are intended to KILL. and yes, that includes people. I don't think people go hunting with AK-47's and M4's. Or even a handgun for that matter..

Then, according to this logic, USA should have the lowest crime rates in the world, because there are lots of guns around and "criminals" could never know if their victims are carrying, so they'd be spending their lives "reconsidering". And I'm the one who's dreaming?
Lol.


And how many people have been killed because there are too many guns around in the hands of people who are not coldblooded/trained enough to use them as "deterrent"?


Sure they may do not, that's what scares me about the "impossibility" to change your mind. You get scared, you shoot, you kill. You regret killing for the rest of your life. It's not that you can set your gun to "stun" instead of "kill". Lots of people carrying guns are simply not trained enough on how to use one "properly"(blah), as I said earlier.

I won't even argue with the cars issue because it's just too stupid.

most people that own these guns use them for little more than target practice.

uhhhyeh.

This. Owning a gun for self-defense is a ridiculous reason--and dangerous. Even if you're the best trained cop, you still can be taken by surprise, and by the time you react to a potential threat (e.g., somebody pulling a gun on you) by reaching for your gun, you'll be shot. Plus your adrenaline will be high and likely will affect your accuracy and control over your weapon.

A scenario like that in real life is unpredictable. Studies have shown that you're likely to put yourself in greater harm by showing that you have a gun--your attacker is more likely to shoot you if he thinks he might get shot by you.

i definitely don't think that someone would go on a killing spree in their school if they didn't have easy access to a gun. however, i definitely do not think that gun related deaths happen only because of easy access to guns but to a larger picture, which i can't, at the moment, say exactly what it is.

Blame violent video games.

It's nothing but PC posturing bollocks from the trotskyite hacks of the media.

Real men use their teeth.

That's the thing though....when 15 year old kids have easy access to drugs of all varieties, how could one ever expect to make access to guns more difficult? I'm not saying it's impossible, but it certainly feels as such.

Statistics, please?

I'm WAYYYY willing to bet most that own these sort of firearms use them for little more than target practice. Only folks I know that own them are ex military and seldom even use them for target practice. More show pieces that stay locked up in storage facilities/gun cases than anything else.

Euros will never know the joy of hunting texas sized spiders with a SPAS-12.

Lol @ Franchi S.p.A. thanks, Italy!

eat semi auto,.Charlotte.

OK...first and foremost I personally do not own a gun. Also, I don't live in fear of violence or anything of this nature. I'm not opposed to purchasing a gun just for the hell of locking it in a drawer in the case it's ever needed, but I've yet to do so. Maybe one day. Guns themselves hold little interest for me...but the right to own them holds a lot. Guns are likely the most effective method of self defense, and this is a right people SHOULD have. There are places, taken I was forced to move to, I'd immediately purchase a gun. For the time being I think my dog will suffice. He's a sweety, but being the pit he is most assume otherwise. Intruders don't concern me in the least.


How many have been killed because of careless and or cold blooded types? Tons, I'm sure. But still, a relatively small number when considering how many people own guns. I'd personally be willing to bet most die in auto-related accidents. Some say this is a tacky comparison, I think not. Cars are dangerous and plenty of careless assholes that barely know how to drive are out on the streets in record numbers.

I'm not one of those liberals that feels the government needs to be involved in every aspect of my so called "safety". Let people do as they will, weed out the bad apples (via jail) whenever necessary.

This is a debate that people will never come to an agreement on. I understand both sides of the coin, but stand firm in my personal beliefs.

What's the going rate on a hogzilla these days?

I'm sure it takes bringing home the bacon to a new level.

O, god..-bacon

Fuck farmers.

Them're mean. I'd do it just to have my picture taken next to one that's been strung up.

:):):)

I have no real take on this. I agree schools SHOULD BE a place where guns shouldn't be necessary. I also agree they seldom ever are necessary. how many school shootings have there been in the last 50 years? How does this number compare when looking at how many students have went through schools over the same duration of time? It's gotta be a small number. Again, I have no real take on this. I just know most people have no interest in killing others. Why some choose to act as if they do is beyond me...

Students always protest all sorts of stupid shit, though. It's like they think "I'm young, I'm a student, I should protest absolutely everything". My latest fav are in-debt college graduates looking for debt forgiveness for whatever loans they took out while going to school. Not my fault...theirs. They should pay. Everyone should be responsible for their own actions...in no case should the majority suffer because someone thought they were guaranteed a great career with a philosophy or art degree.

you and i are living in a separate reality. Your arguement is insane, illogical, and generally incomprehensible to me. And your attempts to defend it only get more ridiculous.

As far as i see it, thats the American way

amen to that.

Well, your "reality" is an idea. Mine is not...it's actuality.

amen? lol

I just want Sway to replace Judge Judy

i would feel much more comfortable with my taxes going to subsidize education and medical care than the US army, the israeli army, and oil companies and whatnot. why are people so quick to shout "handout" for shit that is so important for a healthy society but never talk about the amount of money that goes into the military, and other destructive groups.

What if the US military hadn't existed during WWII?

Just asking.

Sure, it's done some "destructive stuff", but it's also been vital at times.

the us military's budget is over 600 billion $ a year. that is a lot of money for an army of a country that is not under attack by any other country.

Agreed. Honestly, I do agree...

I just refuse to look at the military as nothing other than a "destructive force". it's done some good. Sure, some shitty stuff has happened but lots of good has happened as well. Sad we live in a world to where a military is even needed...but, it is.

it has done necessary stuff. but at the moment it does not. for the past decade its wars have cost over a trillion dollars and hundreds of thousand if not over a million lives in iraq and afghanistan not to mention millions of refugees. the us' military budget is the highest it has been since WWII and for what? why is that much money needed now? if there were extensive budget cuts then the country could easily afford subsidizing healthcare and education for example, something that would benefit US citizens and the rest of the world much more than purchasing and testing new weapons.